JaysCyYoung
Legend
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
I really don't know why either. Please cease.
I really don't know why either. Please cease.
OT: 2014 Olympic Hockey Thread
- Thread starter hairnova
- Start date
Habsy
Yes, I'm kidding people.
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
I don't understand why anyone really gives a shit about something as meaningless as another person's opinion about a player. Sure it's fun to debate but ultimately, who gives a darn what another fan thinks of a player?
I don't understand why anyone really gives a shit about something as meaningless as another person's opinion about a player. Sure it's fun to debate but ultimately, who gives a darn what another fan thinks of a player?
JaysCyYoung
Legend
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
People obviously care when it comes to things like awards recognition and international competitions (when national pride is at stake). I personally wouldn't take Phaneuf because I don't think he's a good fit on the wider ice surface - the same reason I wouldn't take Subban either at this point - but that doesn't mean they're poor players.
People obviously care when it comes to things like awards recognition and international competitions (when national pride is at stake). I personally wouldn't take Phaneuf because I don't think he's a good fit on the wider ice surface - the same reason I wouldn't take Subban either at this point - but that doesn't mean they're poor players.
zeke
Well-known member
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
Power Play
P.Subban: 42gms, 7gls, 26pts, 4:42 (82gms, 14gls, 51pts) - #2 toi on #5 PP in the NHL
D.Phaneuf: 48gms, 3gls, 16pts, 3:24 (82gms, 5gls, 27pts) - #1 toi on #14 PP in the NHL
Even Strength
P.Subban: 42gms, 4gls, 12pts, 17:05 (82gms, 8gls, 23pts) - #4 toi on #6 5/5 in the NHL
D.Phaneuf: 48gms, 6gls, 11pts, 18:39 (82gms, 10gls, 19pts) - #1 toi on #12 5/5 in the NHL
Penaly Kill
P.Subban: 42gms, 1:27 - #5 toi on #23 PK in the NHL (actually #6 but I ignored Drewiske's limited sample size)
D.Phaneuf: 48gms, 3:06 - #1 toi on #2 PK in the NHL
quite literally, Subban was a supreme PP player last year, but a #4/5 guy in all other situations.
Power Play
P.Subban: 42gms, 7gls, 26pts, 4:42 (82gms, 14gls, 51pts) - #2 toi on #5 PP in the NHL
D.Phaneuf: 48gms, 3gls, 16pts, 3:24 (82gms, 5gls, 27pts) - #1 toi on #14 PP in the NHL
Even Strength
P.Subban: 42gms, 4gls, 12pts, 17:05 (82gms, 8gls, 23pts) - #4 toi on #6 5/5 in the NHL
D.Phaneuf: 48gms, 6gls, 11pts, 18:39 (82gms, 10gls, 19pts) - #1 toi on #12 5/5 in the NHL
Penaly Kill
P.Subban: 42gms, 1:27 - #5 toi on #23 PK in the NHL (actually #6 but I ignored Drewiske's limited sample size)
D.Phaneuf: 48gms, 3:06 - #1 toi on #2 PK in the NHL
quite literally, Subban was a supreme PP player last year, but a #4/5 guy in all other situations.
Habsy
Yes, I'm kidding people.
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
You're talking politics though. There is no way you cannot invite Subban after winning the Norris, regardless of whether you think he deserved it or not.
Personally, I take Subban over Phaneuf on the bigger ice surface because he is faster and far more mobile. Especially when considering he'd likely be paired with a more defensively aware partner.
You're talking politics though. There is no way you cannot invite Subban after winning the Norris, regardless of whether you think he deserved it or not.
Personally, I take Subban over Phaneuf on the bigger ice surface because he is faster and far more mobile. Especially when considering he'd likely be paired with a more defensively aware partner.
Habsy
Yes, I'm kidding people.
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
Subban was sheltered last year, I agree. That doesn't mean he didn't perform at a Norris level.
Subban was sheltered last year, I agree. That doesn't mean he didn't perform at a Norris level.
JaysCyYoung
Legend
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
Huh?
No one is complaining about him being invited. It's whether or not the invitees deserve to make the team that is the contentious issue.
Huh?
No one is complaining about him being invited. It's whether or not the invitees deserve to make the team that is the contentious issue.
JaysCyYoung
Legend
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
He's the first Norris recipient I can think of in the history of the award that wasn't a league leader in ice-time.
He's the first Norris recipient I can think of in the history of the award that wasn't a league leader in ice-time.
worm
Well-known member
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
The sheltered line is the one I find the funniest. When he first came back, he was punished by management and was on the 3rd pair for what six games. After that, his icetime went through the roof and there was no "sheltering" whatever the hell that means.
Sheltering is a pejorative term that implies the team was keeping him from playing the top players on other teams out of fear he could not do the job. That is hardly the case regarding Subban.
He might have been on the "second" pair but there is no way management saw him as at best the 3rd best d on the team.
Hell, even at the beginning of the season, he was only on the second pair of the power play as Diaz/Markov were on the top pair. Who in their right mind would claim Diaz is ahead of Subban in our pecking order.
Sheltering is a bullshit argument created by some dork sitting at a computer and is meaningless.
The sheltered line is the one I find the funniest. When he first came back, he was punished by management and was on the 3rd pair for what six games. After that, his icetime went through the roof and there was no "sheltering" whatever the hell that means.
Sheltering is a pejorative term that implies the team was keeping him from playing the top players on other teams out of fear he could not do the job. That is hardly the case regarding Subban.
He might have been on the "second" pair but there is no way management saw him as at best the 3rd best d on the team.
Hell, even at the beginning of the season, he was only on the second pair of the power play as Diaz/Markov were on the top pair. Who in their right mind would claim Diaz is ahead of Subban in our pecking order.
Sheltering is a bullshit argument created by some dork sitting at a computer and is meaningless.
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
what was that you said about following you around and quoting you?
what was that you said about following you around and quoting you?
JaysCyYoung
Legend
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
You don't think a coach being unwilling to play a supposed top-tier defenceman in multiple situations, and in fact playing less-talented defenders ahead of him in important circumstances reflects negatively on that player?
Just because you clearly don't understand the arguments doesn't detract from their validity. If you're elite you play in all situations. Like a Weber or a Suter.
You don't think a coach being unwilling to play a supposed top-tier defenceman in multiple situations, and in fact playing less-talented defenders ahead of him in important circumstances reflects negatively on that player?
Just because you clearly don't understand the arguments doesn't detract from their validity. If you're elite you play in all situations. Like a Weber or a Suter.
worm
Well-known member
JaysCyYoung
Legend
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
:shocked:
:shocked:
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
Therrien was breaking him allegedly to play more as a team guy. Once he was broken, then he played a lot.
If you want to believe that is somehow based on fact Therrien and management didn't think he could do the job that a superstar like Phaneuf allegedly can do, fine, we who watched all of the games know that is not the case.
Therrien was breaking him allegedly to play more as a team guy. Once he was broken, then he played a lot.
If you want to believe that is somehow based on fact Therrien and management didn't think he could do the job that a superstar like Phaneuf allegedly can do, fine, we who watched all of the games know that is not the case.
JaysCyYoung
Legend
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
I don't know why you insist on repeatedly bringing Phaneuf into the discussion. He has no bearing on the fact that Suter was the best defender in the league last year.
If you want to continually stick to the farcical argument that Subban was merely being "broken into" (which actually demonstrates less confidence in him on the coaching staff's part), then that's your prerogative. I find it unconvincing.
I don't know why you insist on repeatedly bringing Phaneuf into the discussion. He has no bearing on the fact that Suter was the best defender in the league last year.
If you want to continually stick to the farcical argument that Subban was merely being "broken into" (which actually demonstrates less confidence in him on the coaching staff's part), then that's your prerogative. I find it unconvincing.
worm
Well-known member
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
I would rather forget that season as well. At least it got us AG.
I would rather forget that season as well. At least it got us AG.
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
Well why didn't you say so before, you aren't convinced, I guess it means it is a meaningless argument because after all, posts that don't convince you are meaningless.
You don't follow the Canadiens, don't watch all the games, so really you should defer to those of us who do.
Well why didn't you say so before, you aren't convinced, I guess it means it is a meaningless argument because after all, posts that don't convince you are meaningless.
You don't follow the Canadiens, don't watch all the games, so really you should defer to those of us who do.
Re: OT: Team Canada Olympic Orientation Camp Roster
Yeah, Gunnarsson definitely carried Dion for half the year.