Around The League - 2024-25 Regular Season

[wiseguy1]

I thought Treliving initially got alot of kudos for getting the players he did to replace the ones who wanted out. It just hasn't worked out. Then he left for a better job in Toronto.

 

[Sal_Butera]

I thought Treliving initially got alot of kudos for getting the players he did to replace the ones who wanted out. It just hasn't worked out. Then he left for a better job in Toronto.

He couldn’t get along w Sutter and felt slighted for not being consulted w hiring & contract extension

But yes, Treliving received unanimous kudos for the Tkachuk deal given the situation

 

[WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou]

last line is the best outcome , how the hell did Hugo even come up with this flow chart

2025 1st round pick (CGY) [Conditional]*
*Conditions: 1. If CGY’s 2024 1st round pick is between 20 and 32, MTL can take that pick instead. Result: TBD

Scenario: In the event CGY receives FLA’s 2025 1st round pick:
1. If both CGY AND FLA’s picks are NOT top 10, MTL will receive the better of the CGY and FLA 2025 1st round picks. Result: TBD

2. If CGY’s pick is top 10, AND FLA’s pick is NOT top 10, MTL receives FLA’s pick. Result: TBD


Scenario: In the event CGY does NOT receive FLA’s 1st round pick:

Sub-scenario: CGY’s pick is NOT top 10
1. MTL will receive the CGY pick, and
2. If FLA’s pick is not top 10, is a better pick than CGY’s, and was transferred to another team due to prior conditions, MTL will also receive CGY’s 2025 4th round pick.
Result: TBD

Sub-scenario: CGY’s pick is top 10:
1. If CGY’s pick is 1st overall, MTL will receive CGY’s 2025 3rd, and the better of CGY and FLA’s 2026 1st round pick. Result: TBD

2. If CGY’s pick is 2nd to 10th, MTL receives CGY’s 2025 1st round pick. Result: TBD

That could get tasty if the Flames go into a 3 or 4 year death spiral.

 

[WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou]

Not just that, it's a hindrance. It kills interest. You've seen it firsthand: If you know your team is going to suck and they're going to suck for the foreseeable future, you drift to something else. It's something that literally drives fans away.

Why is the NFL the king of sports in America and the other three leagues combined don't even come to the ankles of the NFL? Besides a couple of teams like the Lions and Browns who are perennial losers, and even then they've gotten better in recent times, teams don't suck for very long. A team that finishes in the basement this year has a realistic chance at making the playoffs next year with one good draft and roster make-over.

The NHL needs to do one of two things, either eliminate the hard cap or reduce the maximum term limit on contracts & eliminate no move/trade clauses. While the players would never agree to that, the NHL could give the players something in return that would make the league 10x better overnight: Earlier UFA status. Instead of being a full-on UFA after 7 accrued seasons or 27 years old, make it after 4 accrued seasons or 24 years old.

You want a real free agency frenzy? When you could give a 24 year old UFA a five year contract in the prime of his career?

True but on the bright side the current system is what has ensured nearly 2 decades of playoff futility for the Leafs. They've not won a damn thing since the cap was instituted. Prior to that, they could outspend their mistakes and go to the 3rd round.

I like it better this way.

 

[xposbrad]

Meanwhile, in Calgary...

Nazem Kadri: 9GP, 1G 1A 2PTS - $7M until 2028-2029
Jonathan Huberdeau: 9GP, 2G 3A 5PTS - $10.5M until 2030-2031
Jacob Markstrom 7GP .901 S% - $6M until 2025-2026

With Hanifin, Lindholm, Zadorov & Tanev UFAs at the end of this season and an unremarkable prospect pool.

Man, they are so fucked. They are so, so, so beyond fucked. They literally don't have a good, logical path to follow. They can't blow it up, they got Kadri & Huberdeau there as a win-now move and even if they don't live up to their contracts, they'll still be decent enough to get Calgary as fringe playoff contenders year over year, not allowing them to get to the basement. They can't go for it either when they've spent more than 25% of their cap on three players that are playing like anchors. All three of their contracts are buyout proof too.

When comes time to paying those players in their late 20s, early 30s... You better be careful. Just one of those contracts will fuck your team beyond any bad first round pick ever could.

I'm happy all three of them got paid, but the NHL needs to do something to fix problems like this. You can't have a franchise be dead to rights for the next decade because of two bad contracts under a hard cap system. All three other sports have ways to maneuver your way around bad contracts. NBA has reasonable term limits, MLB has a soft cap and NFL has (99.9% of the time) contracts that aren't fully guaranteed & most players can be cut from the roster in the second or third year into their second contract without too much of a cap penalty.

T

 

[GrandWazoo]

Not just that, it's a hindrance. It kills interest. You've seen it firsthand: If you know your team is going to suck and they're going to suck for the foreseeable future, you drift to something else. It's something that literally drives fans away.

Why is the NFL the king of sports in America and the other three leagues combined don't even come to the ankles of the NFL? Besides a couple of teams like the Lions and Browns who are perennial losers, and even then they've gotten better in recent times, teams don't suck for very long. A team that finishes in the basement this year has a realistic chance at making the playoffs next year with one good draft and roster make-over.

The NHL needs to do one of two things, either eliminate the hard cap or reduce the maximum term limit on contracts & eliminate no move/trade clauses. While the players would never agree to that, the NHL could give the players something in return that would make the league 10x better overnight: Earlier UFA status. Instead of being a full-on UFA after 7 accrued seasons or 27 years old, make it after 4 accrued seasons or 24 years old.

You want a real free agency frenzy? When you could give a 24 year old UFA a five year contract in the prime of his career?

That was pretty much the point I made with #3.

I think 24 years old pretty much kills any benefit in drafting and development, which might not be good for the players since teams won’t care as much to develop them. It would be a different dynamic, not sure if I like it, I feel too much player movement is not great for fans.

I’d just change the buyout rules and maybe introduce a soft cap. Change the buyout rules to count for 50% of the remaining contract and let teams decide over how many years they want to spread it (with an upper limit of max contract length). Players can still get the same amount so they shouldn’t be impacted by this change.

This would allow rebuilding teams to front load buyouts and contenders to spread it out longer as needed.

 

[TheCountofMonteCristo]

True but on the bright side the current system is what has ensured nearly 2 decades of playoff futility for the Leafs. They've not won a damn thing since the cap was instituted. Prior to that, they could outspend their mistakes and go to the 3rd round.

I like it better this way.

we haven't either

 

[WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou]

we haven't either

Yes but we weren't throwing money at our mistakes even before the cap. Our previous owners, in addition to not having the balls to hire competent anglophone managers, were also notoriously cheap. We weren't winning under either system.

 

[Sal_Butera]

That was pretty much the point I made with #3.

I think 24 years old pretty much kills any benefit in drafting and development, which might not be good for the players since teams won’t care as much to develop them. It would be a different dynamic, not sure if I like it, I feel too much player movement is not great for fans.

I’d just change the buyout rules and maybe introduce a soft cap. Change the buyout rules to count for 50% of the remaining contract and let teams decide over how many years they want to spread it (with an upper limit of max contract length). Players can still get the same amount so they shouldn’t be impacted by this change.

This would allow rebuilding teams to front load buyouts and contenders to spread it out longer as needed.

I think Habs should simply trade every 1st rounder in Dach type deals for assets on ELC or about to start 2nd contracts. Been saying it for a while - I’m convinced the probability of successful team building increases

As Yankees GM Brian Cashman said long ago, despite being the head of amateur scouting & development that put that 90s team together - “our market is not suited for drafting & developing players”

 

[Krustchev]

I think Habs should simply trade every 1st rounder in Dach type deals for assets on ELC or about to start 2nd contracts. Been saying it for a while - I’m convinced the probability of successful team building increases

As Yankees GM Brian Cashman said long ago, despite being the head of amateur scouting & development that put that 90s team together - “our market is not suited for drafting & developing players”

Yeah, the Yankees were dumb for not trading the 32nd pick in the first round of the 2013 MLB draft for some young MLB players. To save Sal the trouble of looking that up, that player was Aaron Judge.

 

[GEEMAN]

The whole "don't be dumb" argument holds no ground or merit because every day you'll have very intelligent people make poor decisions with consequences. To say "don't be dumb" also ignores external factors beyond the control of the person making those decisions. Don't wanna give Tkachuk/Gaudreau/Kadri/Huberdeau long term deals? Don't wanna give Hanifin & the other pending UFAs long-term contracts? Cool story, then those guys are all gone and in a cap league where every team is counting dollars, there's not a great market to trade those players. The players have a lot of leverage in this, whether you like it or not.

Also, another external factor: While I have no proof of this, it seems rather obvious to me that the upper management / ownership in Calgary loves to have their fingerprints on the roster. If you're a GM and ownership demands that you sign players regardless of the cost, welp...

All parties are to blame , simply put you live and die by bad decisions

This isnt Amazon where Bezos snaps his finger and wipes out divisions , pays severance and moves on

 

[GEEMAN]

I think you're missing the point.

1) "Don't be stupid" has never been an effective preventive solution to anything, ever.
2) The person who caused the damage is gone but his move will impair the organization for almost a decade. This is the only sport that doesn't offer a way out to turn things around.
3) There is no benefit for the league or the team to have an hopeless franchise for a decade. It's not good for anyone.

Every team understands the challenges of a hard cap world

When you get to the point of no return , you dont double down giving EK 11.5 and resigning Hertl to to 8x 8 using the Sharks as an example

Cmon these are moronic moves like giving 11 and 31....... 17 mil in dead caps space

 

[GEEMAN]

Auston Matthews, to his credit, is one of the very rare players in the history of the league that has taken full advantage of his leverage and his understanding of the economics of the league to his benefit.

Why McDavid took an 8 year is beyond me and it's sheer lunacy. It's a heist by Deadmonton. He should have taken a 4 or 3 year deal at the same cap number, and he would have had Deadmonton by the balls. He'd get a new contract for another 3-4 years and he'd be making $15M. And then, depending on how he feels, he could then take yet another 3-4 year contract at $18M+, and finally, when he's finally in the late 20s, early 30s, finally take an 8 year $20M+ contract.

CMD took 100+ for life security , way more time to make more

34 needs to stay healthy to get another record breaking deal at 30

 

[GrandWazoo]

I think Habs should simply trade every 1st rounder in Dach type deals for assets on ELC or about to start 2nd contracts. Been saying it for a while - I’m convinced the probability of successful team building increases

As Yankees GM Brian Cashman said long ago, despite being the head of amateur scouting & development that put that 90s team together - “our market is not suited for drafting & developing players”

Yeah I’ve been saying the same thing for a while, picks are the most overrated commodity at the moment, a shrewd GM should take advantage and trade those lotto tickets for established players or NHL players with upside. The exception would be too 5 picks.

Had MB traded all his first round picks, we might had won a Cup, giving how good he was at trading and how terrible he was at drafting.

 

[GrandWazoo]

Every team understands the challenges of a hard cap world

When you get to the point of no return , you dont double down giving EK 11.5 and resigning Hertl to to 8x 8 using the Sharks as an example

Cmon these are moronic moves like giving 11 and 31....... 17 mil in dead caps space

They do, and yet they do it every year, because GMs are humans, flawed and with ego clouding their judgment. Also plenty of players don’t hold their part of the bargain, if they’re not performing up to contract, there should be a way for teams to get out of it.

 

[GEEMAN]

That was pretty much the point I made with #3.

I think 24 years old pretty much kills any benefit in drafting and development, which might not be good for the players since teams won’t care as much to develop them. It would be a different dynamic, not sure if I like it, I feel too much player movement is not great for fans.

I’d just change the buyout rules and maybe introduce a soft cap. Change the buyout rules to count for 50% of the remaining contract and let teams decide over how many years they want to spread it (with an upper limit of max contract length). Players can still get the same amount so they shouldn’t be impacted by this change.

This would allow rebuilding teams to front load buyouts and contenders to spread it out longer as needed.

You can buyout a player under 26 at 1/3 salary if you think it makes sense

I agree on your buyout rule adjustments

Stop handing out trade clauses to half your roster and the Zamboni driver

Things that will never fly are non guarantee or walk away deals with option years

Simply put league handed the keys to the asylum to the players , be smarter with your decisions

 

[GEEMAN]

Yeah I’ve been saying the same thing for a while, picks are the most overrated commodity at the moment, a shrewd GM should take advantage and trade those lotto tickets for established players or NHL players with upside. The exception would be too 5 picks.

Had MB traded all his first round picks, we might had won a Cup, giving how good he was at trading and how terrible he was at drafting.

Habs were not winning a cup

 

[CH1]

Yeah I’ve been saying the same thing for a while, picks are the most overrated commodity at the moment, a shrewd GM should take advantage and trade those lotto tickets for established players or NHL players with upside. The exception would be too 5 picks.

Had MB traded all his first round picks, we might had won a Cup, giving how good he was at trading and how terrible he was at drafting.

that's why I'm interested to see what Monahan and Pearson net us at the deadline --- HuGo has shown that he's interested in B+ prospects as much as he is in getting 2nd round picks

 

[Habspatrol]

For anyone like me who didn't want to watch the Adam Johnson incident because of the gore and didn't want to see something that you can't unsee. Here's a slowed down and zoomed in clip of the "hit." It cuts off right after the contact so there's no blood or anything. There's zero doubt in my mind that the guy intentionally kicked him. I very much doubt that he intended to kill him or even cut him with his blade though.

 

[Habsy]

Manslaughter