• Moderators, please send me a PM if you are unable to access mod permissions. Thanks, Habsy.

OT: American Politics

Re: OT: Canadian Politics

As the other teacher on this board, I don't want to get into all the nitpicking about what was already written....

This is a good article though printed in the "Sudburystar" about teachers choosing not to do some extra curriculur (sp) activities. I personally have coached numerous sports and clubs every year. Was on the governing board for Soccer and Basketball... Ran the soccer and basketball for all of East Toronto for years. Even was on the committee that wrote the constitution and playing regs for basketball and soccer. So I personally get super pissed that I need to called an ahole for not doing something this year out of the 15 I have been teaching.

PoV: Teachers' volunteer work not kids' entitlement 13

ANDREA DEMEER

Monday, October 1, 2012 6:13:03 EDT AM

In the past few weeks, Ontario parents as well as politicians have enjoyed much chest-beating over the decision by some elementary teachers and schools to opt out of providing extracurricular activities.
One thing is certain. The people hollering the loudest have never once gone out of their way to thank a teacher for field marshalling the cross country meet, organizing a fundraiser to support a class trip, or mentoring the chess club.
These extras and others, that so enrich the education experience, get taken for granted.

All of a sudden, we are demonizing professionals for making the simple choice not to volunteer. It is a spoiled school community, one lousy with a misplaced sense of entitlement, which takes such a position.
At the risk of oversimplifying, teachers get paid to teach. They do not get paid to direct the school play, conduct the choir or run the book fair. Still, at the elementary level, teachers spend an average of 2.7 hours a week on extracurricular activities. This is a bonus for students and their families. A plus.

The teacher who volunteers to coach the school basketball team is only different from the guy down the street who coaches minor hockey in a couple of respects. It is unlikely the teacher has a child on the starting line every year, and the teacher doesn't get a dozen Tim Hortons gift cards from grateful parents at season's end.

Imagine a society where every professional donates at least three hours a week in a capacity related to his or her field. Professional chefs help out at soup kitchens, journalists participate in adult literacy programs, and nurses visit the sick and elderly in their homes. It would be wonderful, but no one expects it will happen. No one demands it and no one criticizes chefs and journalists and nurses for not doing it.

Only teachers are held accountable for how they use their free time.

Regardless of whether you support the government or the unions in this latest educational horn-lock, the unpaid hours teachers spend working with children should only ever be seen as a gift.
When the dust settles -- and it will -- students and parents might view that gift with a little more appreciation.
Click to expand...
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

This is a good article though printed in the "Sudburystar" about teachers choosing not to do some extra curriculur (sp) activities. I personally have coached numerous sports and clubs every year. Was on the governing board for Soccer and Basketball... Ran the soccer and basketball for all of East Toronto for years. Even was on the committee that wrote the constitution and playing regs for basketball and soccer. So I personally get super pissed that I need to called an ahole for not doing something this year out of the 15 I have been teaching.
Click to expand...
You're probably the type of guy that would volunteer as a coach anyways if you weren't a teacher.

That doesn't take anything away from your service, but just a reminder that alot of people spend their time assisting in various sports or community activity.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

corksens said:
You're probably the type of guy that would volunteer as a coach anyways if you weren't a teacher.

That doesn't take anything away from your service, but just a reminder that alot of people spend their time assisting in various sports or community activity.
Click to expand...

I think his point is though, that nobody else gets shit on for not volunteering. He's right here, very.

With that said, I'm entirely, entirely cool with the idea of compensating teachers for the time given to the major extra curricular activities (sports, drama, music, etc).
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

No argument there. Though I do detest the notion that he is not volunteering this year as some kind of a political statement...clearly the only ones that suffer are the students.

I'm cool with that too...but I'm not sure how much added compensation is needed. They do get 2 months off per year remember.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

corksens said:
No argument there. Though I do detest the notion that he is not volunteering this year as some kind of a political statement...clearly the only ones that suffer are the students.

I'm cool with that too...but I'm not sure how much added compensation is needed. They do get 2 months off per year remember.
Click to expand...

2 months off is a great perk, but we hire them to teach math...not coach basketball on their evenings and weekends. When someone goes outside the standard scope of their employment, giving their own time in the process, they deserve to be compensated addtionally...over top of what those who make the choice to not give their own time are compensated.

Provide an additional service, be provided an additional compensation. That's the absolute basics of capitalism.
 
obama is only a rockstar in his own mind.....and those who still drink his coolaid. The Muslim world hates him at a record level despite the Cairo policy of appeasement. His sputterings in Cairo of The New Begining is now a new low. Total failure .

I was going to link some artcles but why bother. Gurgle obama.muslim.popularity and you get a million hits with headlines like "Faded Rockstar" to far worse.

Read and weep at the source.....

http://www.pewglobal.org/2012/06/13/global-opinion-of-obama-slips-international-policies-faulted/

http://dailycaller.com/2012/06/14/poll-finds-obamas-approval-among-muslims-reaches-new-lows/

Even the leftist Telegraph mocks him and his cultivated but failing popularity.....

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/t...-is-with-obama-the-man-not-america-the-brand/
 
Last edited:
Krustchev said:
Let's be fair here. He paid 14% as a capital gains tax. He presumably already paid taxes on that money before (he invested it) at a much higher rate, when he earned it as regular old income when he ran Bain. Just saying.
Click to expand...

Presumably??
I was referring to the one and only tax return he released - which was also his most recent tax return, so his Bain salaries don't factor in on that one.
Besides, it was more a joke about his "job creators" group.
 
Habsy said:
Actually, I would love performance based tax breaks. I employ 39 people. If a small business can show growth and show that they create jobs then give them a tax break incentive.
Click to expand...

You've got my vote, Habsy.
If Romney employed 500 people last year in America, and he gets tax breaks that bring him down to 13%, then I have no issue.
Getting 13% for nothing but loopholes and offshore bank accounts.... now that IS a problem.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

hockeylover said:
Are teachers not already essentially working to rule right now anyways?
Click to expand...

theREALkoreaboy said:
officially, no.
Click to expand...

hockeylover said:
But unofficially, yes. Hence why I said "essentially".
Click to expand...

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/sudbury/story/2012/09/24/sby-extracurricular-activities.html

http://www.ottawasun.com/2012/09/11/students-losing-out-in-teachers-battle

http://www.themeafordindependent.ca/home/in-the-schools/2592-gbss-students-stage-walkout

http://www.southwesternontario.ca/c...tudents-walk-out-we-have-the-strongest-voice/

http://martialartsottawa.com/tag/ontario-teachers-cancel-extra-curricular-activities/

theREALkoreaboy said:
officially, no.
Click to expand...
Score one for the female hockey fan.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

<3

sheep, as someone who is inside the teachers' federation and who is entirely informed on the legalities of the situation, i can tell you with 100% confidence that we (in my area anyways) are NOT officially "working to rule" right now.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

I was going to write earlier on this as well.

Despite those articles, teachers right now are in a major dilemma on extracurricular. Every school, and every teacher is making their own choice.

There are schools in my area that are still running everything as usual, and some that have put a complete stop to all things. It all really depends on the choices of the people there. But I assure you that this is not a decision taken lightly by some.

There are many a staff room that are having major conflicts within. (mine for example) There are a group that believe we should cut everything as our sign on protest. Others believe it means doing less than what you normally do.. (ie do one activity a year instead of 2 or 3. Others think that all our pause is doing is getting the parents against us when our beef isn't with the parents.

To assume that all teachers are happy to go to work to rule (which it isn't) is not true. The problem is that the union can't go out and say "go on work to rule" as it is against the legislation. But all this does is lead to confusion and lack of direction as job action is being interpreted differently by everyone.

I hate coming to work most days, because you feel like you are being watched by the Gestapo militants, and every decision (when you come in, when you leave etc) is being critiqued by some.

I also am in a community that is upper middle class, and they are PISSED that little Jimmy (not Thiva, or Malik cuz the school is like 90 white) can't run in cross country. Yet, Jimmy leaves school every Friday for Hockey, and his sister leaves Thursday afternoons for gymnastics, and scouts. BUT good lord, Gof forbid the kid not run in a sanctioned event. All to win. The parents whose kids just go out because its the only sport they can do, don't care... But future Boston marathon white kid needs to have that ribbon and be recognized. It's flippin gross.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

the scenario you're describing hoss is why some of us are arguing for extra curriculars to be among the very LAST things pulled in any job action. it divides staff and upsets parents more than anything. there are so many other ways to put pressure on boards ahead of pulling extra curriculars.

but your point is true- people are deciding not to do things because they are pi$$ed. really, really pi$$ed. mcweasel is ramming us up the poop chute and they want to take a stand.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

First of all I completely agree with ME's point above. If you coach sports or drama or music on top of teaching you absolutely should be compensated. Whether that comes in time, money, or a combination, I don't care. That's just common sense. I can't speak for music or drama, but I played a lot of sports in school and I'd venture to say I learned more life lessons doing that then I ever did in the classroom. So compenstation there I can get behind.

Work to rule never made any sense to me, but I've never been in a union. Why aggrevate the kids/parents when as KB points out, there are many other ways to get your message across.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

And that is what is causing major problems in staff. The fact that the union is deliberatly being vague on what we are to do, it is leaving the militant teachers saying "nothing is to be done" while the other teachers are saying..."but they didn't tell us exactly not to do these things"

My staff has a few nut bars and they are making the whole school follow there lead with bully tactics and talking behind backs. The problem is the two neighbouring schools are running all their sports as per usual... so what does that do? Just gets parents pissed off at us.

It's real crappy right now to be a teacher.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

theyre being vague because they have to be. legally. if they counsel members to take specific job actions at this time before we are in a legal strike position, they can be held personally liable under the law.

the groundwork is being prepped for the legal challenge and for life after 31 Dec. when the province may or may not ban us from taking any action and they might impose a contract. teachers are being encouraged to make a "lifestyle change". think long and hard about how you are being treated and about how seriously your profession is being attacked. in that climate, it would be entirely natural for large numbers of individual teachers to take a step back and say, you know what? if they are going to rip up my contract and take away my legal right to bargain, why would i do all those extras i used to do? not gonna happen anymore.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

Hoss said:
To assume that all teachers are happy to go to work to rule (which it isn't) is not true. The problem is that the union can't go out and say "go on work to rule" as it is against the legislation. But all this does is lead to confusion and lack of direction as job action is being interpreted differently by everyone.
Click to expand...

I don't believe anybody claimed that teachers are "happy" to work to rule, but you can't deny that your union has strongly suggested you do that - despite the legalities you mention. You, yourself may not want to walk away from those extras, but your union was more than happy to tell you that you should.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

large numbers of individual teachers to take a step back and say, you know what? if they are going to rip up my contract and take away my legal right to bargain, why would i do all those extras i used to do? not gonna happen anymore.
Click to expand...
Because you teach out of love for the profession and to support the children?

Well, that used to be the case. Now most of the teachers appear to be in it for a comfy ride.
 
Re: OT: Canadian Politics

get over yourself corks. please dont tell me you are doing your job for the sheer joy of seeing people get mortgages to buy their dream homes.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top