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OT: The Toronto Blue Jays

MindzEye said:
Honestly not sure if Tony gets enough love. 4x gold glover as a Jay but should have been 5x. Blew Alfredo Griffin's doors off in dwar in 85, wasn't even close. Good, above average stick overall but a top 2-3 hitter as a SS in an era where SS's were all glove.

Here's Tony's AL rank among SS's in wRC+ during his time in Toronto

85: 2nd
86: 3rd
87: 3rd
88: 4th (1% behind 3rd)
89: 4th
90: 4th

Over that stretch, Tony was 3rd in the AL in WAR (26.2) among SS's to Alan Trammell (31.0 - HOF) & Cal Ripken Jr (32.8 - HOF)

Then came back as a 36-37 yr old and gave us 2 seasons of over 120 wRC+ at 3B. The only time in his career that he ever sucked in the playoffs, was for the Yankees. Fucking legend.
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Yeah, that comeback stint was unbelievable. I thought he was a corpse but he was old school awesome.
 
MyNameIsJonas said:
Its funny i legit almost included Tony and Stieb in my post, but figured they got slightly more credit by the masses than Ward and Key ( honestly Bell, Moseby as well).

Re Stieb if anyone hasnt watched the 4 part YouTube series on him by Secret Base, they should
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Fuck, I loved Stieb. I watched, and felt his pain on those lost no-hitters, and then when he got it, ah man, what a feeling.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
Yeah, that comeback stint was unbelievable. I thought he was a corpse but he was old school awesome.
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That team with Roger, Hentgen, Tony, Canseco, Green, Cruz, Delgado, Carpenter, Stieb, Gonzalez, juiced Sprague, somehow still Juan Guzman, Escobar, Quantrill, Stewart and Fletcher is probably one of the more underrated Jays teams of all time 88 wins pre wild card when the Yanks were a 114 win wagon and Boston won 92
 
Tiedemann is still a good prospect.

King looks incredible, but he’s 18 and realistically has years and probably at least one major injury before he makes it.

I think Kendry Rojas will be the first of any of these guys to make an impression in MLB, because of age, ability, proximity, and the fact the Twins traded half their team at the deadline. He’ll probably start for the Twins AAA team on Tuesday and could be up this year.
 
wRC+ vRHP / vLHP

1. DH Springer 159 / Springer 117
2. 1B Guerrero 134 / Guerrero 169
3. SS Bichette 121 / Bichette 113
4. C Alejandro 120 / Alejandro 111
5. CF Varsho 132 / Varsho -59
6. 3B Barger 137 / Clement 156
7. RF Loperfido 190 / Loperfido 135
8. 2B Gimenez 100 / Schneider 139
9. LF Lukes 112 / Straw 97

B. UT Clement 60 / Barger 64
B. OF Straw 59 / Lukes 72
B. IF Schneider 89 / Gimenez 22
B. C Heineman 124 / Heineman 201

X. UT France 90 / France 89
X. OF Santander 68 / Santander 46
X. OF Clase 77 / Clase 44
X. IF Jimenez -100 / Jimenez 70
X. C Sanchez 7 / Sanchez 253


Would be sweet if Loperfido could stay hot. Not as hot as he has been but good enough to be an above average bat. Im pretty skeptical but if he's truly lowered his swing and miss rate, then his natural power and athleticism could really shine through.
 
MyNameIsJonas said:
Yankees are poop too, and i dont think Boston is as good as their July and recent play.

We need to get healthy
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Counterpoint: Run Differential is important, always has been important, and outside of one crazy stretch where everything went right, this team hasn't been very good. The Yankees and Red Sox have played under their run diff, and we've played over ours. The hope is that they don't have enough time for that to catch up to everyone involved. Or...we catch another weird mini heater or something to put it away.

The glimmer of hope fwiw that we are good enough is that the pitching has been bad despite elite D playing behind it, and with Max rounding into form, Bieber joining the rotation in the next 2 weeks or so, and the upgrades to the pen...maybe that has gone from bad to average plus. So the floor is probably higher down the stretch with Gausman-Bieber-Berrios-Bassist-Max/Lauer and Dominguez-Varland getting later game innings that were going to Green, Fluharty, busted Yimi, Yariel, etc.

Fwiw, Fangraph's projections have the Jays holding on and winning 91 games, but only going 26-24 down the stretch to do it.
 
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