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Leaf Rumours

zeke said:
here's their cup-winning team, and the bolded players are the ones who are now gone:


C.Kunitz - A.McDonald - T.Selanne
D.Penner - R.Getzlaf - C.Perry
R.Niedermayer - S.Pahlsson - T.Moen
S.Thornton - T.Marchant - B.May
(R.Shannon - G.Parros)

S.Niedermayer - C.Pronger
S.O'Donnell - F.Beauchemin
J.DiPenta - K.Huskins
(R.Jackman)

J-S.Giguere
I.Bryzgalov​
Click to expand...

It's totally beside the point of the discussion, but still, as I said, I don't see much of significance that they lost besides Pronger.

Ice that team now and they're probably no better than where they're at. Maybe even worse.
 
Burke's record speaks for itself.

He took a shitty Canucks team and turned them into a 100+ point team in a very short period of time.

He took a Ducks team that wasn't close to being cup calibre and he turned them into a cup winner.

Burke has proven he can build winning organizations. And he's going to do it in Toronto. It's just going to take him more than 1 year.
 
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He's proven that in his entire career, he could get out of the first round just three times, and only one of those times win a Cup with the core already in place for him.

It does indeed speak for itself.
 
If the Leafs had had Rob Neidermayer at the time, they'd have been able to get Scott.

He gets full credit for landing Pronger.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
He's proven that in his entire career, he could get out of the first round just three times, and only one of those times win a Cup with the core already in place for him.

It does indeed speak for itself.
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Repeating this over and over doesn't make it true.

The Ducks three best players (in the cup year) were acquired by Burke. Over 70% of that Ducks roster was brought in by Burke. That's just reality.
 
Their three best players were not Nieds, Pronger and Selanne.

I think Getz and Perry played just as big a role as the first two, and bigger than Selanne when it counted.

So I'll say the same thing to you - repeating your claims doesn't make it true either.

Will we call anyone a genius if they step into a team with top line center (Getz) and winger (Perry) and goalie (Giggy) in place, with two of the other prime players drawn in due to family (Nieds) and city (Selanne), and the rest of the roster peppered with a few role players?

I wouldn't.
 
Getzlaf and Perry weren't the same players they are today, but both were terrific in the finals. They played their best in the playoffs.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
Their three best players were not Nieds, Pronger and Selanne. .
Click to expand...

Their leading scorer by A LOT and their two best (future hall of fame) defensemen weren't their 3 best players? Really?

LeafOfFaith said:
Will we call anyone a genius if they step into a team with top line center (Getz) and winger (Perry) and goalie (Giggy) in place, with two of the other prime players drawn in due to family (Nieds) and city (Selanne), and the rest of the roster peppered with a few role players?

I wouldn't.
Click to expand...


The Ducks didn't have a cup core in place when Burke arrived.

When Burke was finished, they won a cup, because among other things, he added 3 hall of famers via trade and free agency.

End of story.
 
PlayerToBeNamedLater said:
Their leading scorer by A LOT and their two best (future hall of fame) defensemen weren't their 3 best players? Really?




The Ducks didn't have a cup core in place when Burke arrived.

When Burke was finished, they won a cup, because among other things, he added 3 hall of famers via trade and free agency.

End of story.
Click to expand...

Getzlaf and Perry WERE their leading scorers in the playoffs.

We've already discussed Neids, and I gave credit where due on Pronger.

And yes, the story ended the very next year with a first round exit. And they've never recovered.
 
The team was WAY more than Getzlaf and Perry.

WAY more.

The D was the most important part. And then along with their talent up front was their ability to grind teams into the ground, which was all Burke.

Getzlaf and Perry had an important role. But they couldn't have even gotten to the playoffs without what Burke added.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
It's totally beside the point of the discussion, but still, as I said, I don't see much of significance that they lost besides Pronger.
.
Click to expand...

Yep, losing 17 of the 23 roster players, including 6 of the top 9 forwards, and 3 of the top-4 defensemen, isn't much of significance.

makes sense.
 
Their three best players were not Nieds, Pronger and Selanne.
Click to expand...

Statements like this is why I can't take you serious.

I won't take anything away from Perry or Getzlaf because they had a great run but without Neids and Pronger there is no cup in Anahiem regardless of the team they had

Two veteran future hall of fame defencemen are a rare find one team
 
Neidermayer, Pronger and Beauchemen were on the ice the whole game in that playoff run. Every game.

Literally.

Burke got all of them.
 
Artnes said:
Statements like this is why I can't take you serious.

I won't take anything away from Perry or Getzlaf because they had a great run but without Neids and Pronger there is no cup in Anahiem regardless of the team they had

Two veteran future hall of fame defencemen are a rare find one team
Click to expand...

Without Getzlaf, Perry, McDonald, Pahlsson, and Giggy there was no Cup either.
 
Not sure what everyone is contesting anyway.

All I've said is that the core was in place. And it was. Getz, Perry, Giggy, McDonald, Pahlsson and others.

Did Burke make the necessary additions? Yes. Was getting Pronger a great move? Yes. Was it tough getting Neids and Selanne? No.

He inherited a very good core, had some luck, and added a couple of good pieces on top, and won the Cup with a team that disintegrated the very next year.

Goof for him. Maybe Burke would've been the right man for the job during a couple of the Quinn years, to add the right pieces and win it all.

But Burke has NOT taken a team from the scrap heap to the promised land, or anywhere near it.

It just hasn't happened.

So, you want to project Burke's success from Anaheim to success with the Leafs? Go ahead, but there's no rational connection between the two teams' situations.
 
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