Leaf Rumours
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number17
Mod Squad
First of all, for the sake of keeping the fans, there's no way Edmonton is trading that 1st overall pick ...
And, are you REALLY going to give up Schenn, Stralberg AND Kaberle for Hall / Seguin???
People jump all over Burke for trading 2x1st + 2nd for Kessel.
Meanwhile people are willing to give up Schenn, Stralberg AND Kaberle for a prospect who MAY turn out to be Kessel?
And, are you REALLY going to give up Schenn, Stralberg AND Kaberle for Hall / Seguin???
People jump all over Burke for trading 2x1st + 2nd for Kessel.
Meanwhile people are willing to give up Schenn, Stralberg AND Kaberle for a prospect who MAY turn out to be Kessel?
uncus
Well-known member
Kaberle is a gone ... either this off season or as a free agent ... not worth the money he is going to get.
Stralberg at best has shown capabilities of being a very good 3rd liner and maybe a second ... lots of speed but a little weak around the brain matter.
Schenn is what he is and to get something you have to give up something ...
Is stralberg going to turn out to be as good as kessel ... no, take that to the bank.
Is kaberle going to take the leafs to the promised land ... no .. proven point.
Is schenn going to turn into scott stevens .. I sure hope not, but with the potential of hall and seguin there, it becomes a no brainer.
So yes, you use the pieces outlined for the potential to draft a player that will far exceed anything these 3 have to offer.
Plus the money that might be freed up will allow the leafs to stray into the meat market in july and come home with another top 6 gift.
Would you have traded schenn and kaberle for the first overall in last years draft or the year before ... heck I would trade kaberle in his prime for any one of those players ....
And, are you REALLY going to give up Schenn, Stralberg AND Kaberle for Hall / Seguin???
People jump all over Burke for trading 2x1st + 2nd for Kessel.
And which of these 3 players will even get you a half decent first rounder?
None .... but together the sum of their parts make up the illusion of something really good.
Who on the leafs wouldnt you trade for a chance at one of the top 2 picks this year?
Phaneuff ... maybe
Kessel ... no .. wouldnt do it ...
Bozak .. In a heartbeat
Kadri ... you betchya .... gone
Schenn ... yup, because the possibilities are to enticing
Last edited by a moderator:
JaysCyYoung
Legend
Please stop with the post-padding. Secondly, those are unbelieveably terrible suggested deals. Terrible.
uncus
Well-known member
Excuse me ... but where do you get off on saying my suggestions are terrible ...
They are totally tangible, Edmonton gets the puck moving dman they need and he might resign there ....
A forth overall pick ... not bad
And the rights to Kulimen ... an excellent young 2nd liner.
A top draft pick, a very good Dman and the rights to a good young player.
uncus
Well-known member
18,668 and you say that I am post padding .... lol does it ever rain in your world?:smilewinkgrin:
number17
Mod Squad
uncus, I think a problem here, is your under-estimation of Kaberle's trade value just because you don't like him.
So Kaberle is not going to 'take the Leafs to the promised land'. What is that supposed to mean, really?
Even if your assumption is correct, name me a player who can take the Leafs to the promised land all by himself, that's not named Crosby, Malkin or Ovechkin? (And even Ovie has failed to take the Caps ANYWHERE)
Is say, Staal, a good player? For sure. A good building block going forward? For sure. Is he going to take the Leafs to the promised land all by himself? NO!
When the Ducks won the cup, was it Getzlaf doing all the work? No. Perry? Was it Niedermayer winning the playoff all by himself? Pronger? JSG?
They won the cup because they have a lot of good pieces, but none of them is going to win the cup all by himself.
And Kaberle IS a good piece of the puzzle. Just because he isn't going to win a series all by himself doesn't mean you don't need him on a winning taem. Pittsburgh needed Gonchar for their cup run, but Gonchar isn't going to lead us, or any team, to the promised land all by himself, so what exactly does that prove?
Then, you further downplayed Kaberle's trade value saying he's turning UFA in a year and he's not worth the $$ he's going to get. Exactly what kind of $$ do you think he's going to get? Last time Kaberle signed the $4.25M contract I'm sure a lot of people thought he was going to get more. But he left a lot of $$ on the table because he gave the Leafs a hometown discount. He might very well do that again.
And here's an interesting question. You think Kaberle is going to get a lot of $$ on the open market, but then you also think Kaberle is not gonna be part of a winning team. So why would other GMs pay him the big bucks?
Kaberle is a premiere puck moving offensive defenseman that every winning team needs. At 32, Kaberle still has a lot of years left in the tank because of the game he plays. If we trade away Kaberle, we're gonna have to replace that puck moving game in him. I'm not saying "don't trade Kaberle" ... I am saying don't under-estimate his trade value just because he's got 1 year left on his contract, and we haven't done squad with him in the lineup. We could have Crosby in the lineup and we wouldn't have done squad the last few years, especially with Raycroft / Vesa in goal.
It's a pretty common but a misleading arguement.
So Kaberle is not going to 'take the Leafs to the promised land'. What is that supposed to mean, really?
Even if your assumption is correct, name me a player who can take the Leafs to the promised land all by himself, that's not named Crosby, Malkin or Ovechkin? (And even Ovie has failed to take the Caps ANYWHERE)
Is say, Staal, a good player? For sure. A good building block going forward? For sure. Is he going to take the Leafs to the promised land all by himself? NO!
When the Ducks won the cup, was it Getzlaf doing all the work? No. Perry? Was it Niedermayer winning the playoff all by himself? Pronger? JSG?
They won the cup because they have a lot of good pieces, but none of them is going to win the cup all by himself.
And Kaberle IS a good piece of the puzzle. Just because he isn't going to win a series all by himself doesn't mean you don't need him on a winning taem. Pittsburgh needed Gonchar for their cup run, but Gonchar isn't going to lead us, or any team, to the promised land all by himself, so what exactly does that prove?
Then, you further downplayed Kaberle's trade value saying he's turning UFA in a year and he's not worth the $$ he's going to get. Exactly what kind of $$ do you think he's going to get? Last time Kaberle signed the $4.25M contract I'm sure a lot of people thought he was going to get more. But he left a lot of $$ on the table because he gave the Leafs a hometown discount. He might very well do that again.
And here's an interesting question. You think Kaberle is going to get a lot of $$ on the open market, but then you also think Kaberle is not gonna be part of a winning team. So why would other GMs pay him the big bucks?
Kaberle is a premiere puck moving offensive defenseman that every winning team needs. At 32, Kaberle still has a lot of years left in the tank because of the game he plays. If we trade away Kaberle, we're gonna have to replace that puck moving game in him. I'm not saying "don't trade Kaberle" ... I am saying don't under-estimate his trade value just because he's got 1 year left on his contract, and we haven't done squad with him in the lineup. We could have Crosby in the lineup and we wouldn't have done squad the last few years, especially with Raycroft / Vesa in goal.
JaysCyYoung
Legend
You made eight consecutive posts that were essentially one or two lines in length. Why not compile them into one post so that people don't have to repeatedly scroll over half points? It's an organization issue.
You've been here since 2007 so you should know that many of my posts are Biblical in length (see any of my draft analyses or historical analyses posts for reference). I will make smiley posts once in a while in response to a funny video that has been posted, but for the most part my posts aren't abrupt and I've never posted that many consecutive times in a row without even a response from another poster.
You've been here since 2007 so you should know that many of my posts are Biblical in length (see any of my draft analyses or historical analyses posts for reference). I will make smiley posts once in a while in response to a funny video that has been posted, but for the most part my posts aren't abrupt and I've never posted that many consecutive times in a row without even a response from another poster.
uncus
Well-known member
You've been here since 2007 so you should know that many of my posts are Biblical in length (see any of my draft analyses or historical analyses posts for reference). I will make smiley posts once in a while in response to a funny video that has been posted, but for the most part my posts aren't abrupt and I've never posted that many consecutive times in a row without even a response from another poster
Actually earlier and on the other site ....
Maybe I was just preparing for your obvious rebutals ....
Anyways .... Yes you are right about my obvious disdain for kaberle ...
And I think he will fetch 6 on the open market.
He was not alone in philly or carolina ... he had plenty of support and I vividly remember him being the culprit many times resulting in goals by the mentioned teams.
We have to much money in this defence right now as it stands ... can it take the hit of another 5 - 6 mil (2 mil)?
I say maximize your return with kaberle, and shoot for the stars ....
By the way jays ... remember we were talking, and the comment about fishing? Call me a padder again and you best be careful if we go fishing ... rusty old fish hooks will be flying everywhere ...lol:smile(21):
Actually earlier and on the other site ....
Maybe I was just preparing for your obvious rebutals ....
Anyways .... Yes you are right about my obvious disdain for kaberle ...
And I think he will fetch 6 on the open market.
He was not alone in philly or carolina ... he had plenty of support and I vividly remember him being the culprit many times resulting in goals by the mentioned teams.
We have to much money in this defence right now as it stands ... can it take the hit of another 5 - 6 mil (2 mil)?
I say maximize your return with kaberle, and shoot for the stars ....
By the way jays ... remember we were talking, and the comment about fishing? Call me a padder again and you best be careful if we go fishing ... rusty old fish hooks will be flying everywhere ...lol:smile(21):
JaysCyYoung
Legend
You'd laugh if you ever saw me attempt to do anything like fishing. IrishWolfman wants to get me to go with him up North just to see me try and throw a lure out. So that's probably not the best idea anyways! :lol
No offense Kulemin but he really is the type of guy you can pick up via free agency or for a 2nd or 3rd round pick. You don't get top prospects for guys like that.
You definitely don't get Bobby Ryan for that package. How would you like the Leafs to trade Kessel to CLB for the #4 pick and a 24 year old decent prospect?
Replace the name Thornton with Kaberle and you have my answer to a lot of the trade suggestions in this thread.
Obviously none of us think this will actually happen but at least it's quite fair. I like your thinking.
Really though, Stralberg is a decent overaged prospect, they aren't that tough to come by. Kaberle is awesome, but he is in the last year of his contract. The Leafs have a deep defense and could pick up a decent puck moving dman via free agency or in a smaller trade.
Schenn is the tough one to part with... but getting Taylor Hall would be worth it IMO.
It's tough for fans to come up with fair deals including their players. I know I have troubles doing it with Hab players.
I totally think that your suggestions were fair.... not gonna happen, but fair suggestions.
IrishWolfman
New member
Hey, my favourite trip idea we never ended up doing was picking up our buddy in the Soo and doing some fishing on the French River on the way home. I think it'd be hilarious to watch you try and cast a line while immersed up to your knees.
You guys should really make it a great trip and go up as far as Kenora and do some amazing Pickerel fishing.
IrishWolfman
New member
There are some drives even I'm not crazy enough to make. And you're talking to a guy who hiked it up to Timmins in the dead of winter to watch the U-17 World Hockey Challenge this year. That stretch of the Trans-Can between the Soo and Thunder Bay is a bear.