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He's posted a .921 sv% over 70 games, in 2 of his last 3.25 seasons......saying "every stat screams he's a bad goalie" is a patently absurd statement.
 
Montana said:
Did he?.....I missed that.

I only saw him quote my post in which I said..

...and he responded with "exactly".
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But Montana - That's what Nonis did. He told us he offered him an extension. And now when I say that's dumb, I'm STILL getting resistance from BL. If "virtually everyone agreed" it was silly to extend him to be the #2/#3, and I'm saying it's silly, then why do I have people arguing with me and saying I'm "confused"?
 
BeLeafer said:
I just looked up one goalie to see if I could find something similar. Between December 2000 and January 2001, over 19 games, Ed Belfour did just that.

Fundamental lack of understanding is all in your court.
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Indeed.

Also note Brodeur's annual save percentages between 1998 and 2002:

.906
.910
.906
.906

Guess he sucks too.
 
All of a sudden zeke has become a big fan of teeny weeny sample sizes. Remarkable.

zeke said:
.886sv% last playoffs he was in, and that was 5 years ago.
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6 games. Six. Yes, six.

.897sv% last 2 playoffs, and those were 5 and 6 years ago.
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13 games. Thirteen. Yes, thirteen.

Once made it past the first round.
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Of course, that's such a reliable measure of goaltender performance.

Career .912sv%.
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You know who has a worse career s%?

Patrick Roy, Khabibulin, Belfour, Turco, Ward ...

every single stat screams bad goalie.
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Truly absurd.

His career playoff s% is 8th all time. 8th. His mediocre career s% is 23rd all time ... a mere point behind Brodeur and Giguere.
 
hockeylover said:
But Montana - That's what Nonis did. He told us he offered him an extension. And now when I say that's dumb, I'm STILL getting resistance from BL. If "virtually everyone agreed" it was silly to extend him to be the #2/#3, and I'm saying it's silly, then why do I have people arguing with me and saying I'm "confused"?
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On the surface I absolutely think offering him an extension was a dumb idea.


.....at the same time I have no information about very key variables in the equation. Was Calgary going to eat any/most of his 2014 cap hit? How much was the extension worth per season that Nonis was considering? (given Kipper would have been playing next year for $1.5m, maybe Nonis believed he would play another year or two at that price?)...

Without knowing the details of what Nonis had in mind, it's pretty tough to blast him or laud him......because those few key pieces of information could sway my opinion drastically.
 
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hockeylover said:
But Montana - That's what Nonis did. He told us he offered him an extension. And now when I say that's dumb, I'm STILL getting resistance from BL. If "virtually everyone agreed" it was silly to extend him to be the #2/#3, and I'm saying it's silly, then why do I have people arguing with me and saying I'm "confused"?
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Because you've confused me agreeing with Nonis with trying to explain that his actions are not necessarily stupid or based on lies. I have said nothing about the purported extension beyond saying it does not necessarily conflict with using him as a depth player. But you refuse to even entertain that possibility and would rather assume Nonis is a lying moron.
 
Montana said:
I think it's a dumb idea.


.......then again I know no details about it. Was Calgary going to eat any/most of his 2014 cap hit? How much was the extension worth per season that Nonis was considering? (given Kipper would have been playing next year for $1.5m, maybe Nonis believed he would play another year or two at that price?)...

Without knowing the true details of what Nonis was looking at, I really don't have much to judge him on without making some assumptions about pretty key aspects of it.
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I guess I don't really get arguing that a) Kiprusoff's pretty good, b) that Calgary's gonna give him to us for a good price AND c) eat most of his cap hit next year. They should just keep him if that's true, no?

Like the assertion they'd be able to keep all three and that Kiprusoff could be sent to the Marlies, that scenario seems like a reach to me.
 
Montana said:
I think it's a dumb idea.


.......then again I know no details about it. Was Calgary going to eat any/most of his 2014 cap hit? How much was the extension worth per season that Nonis was considering? (given Kipper would have been playing next year for $1.5m, maybe Nonis believed he would play another year or two at that price?)...

Without knowing the true details of what Nonis was looking at, I really don't have much to judge him on without making some assumptions about pretty key aspects of it.
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Pretty much all that needs to be said. It's the whole Kipper sucks some of us have a problem with.
 
BeLeafer said:
Because you've confused me agreeing with Nonis with trying to explain that his actions are not necessarily stupid or based on lies. I have said nothing about the purported extension beyond saying it does not necessarily conflict with using him as a depth player. But you refuse to even entertain that possibility and would rather assume Nonis is a lying moron.
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Of course I refuse to entertain it. It doesn't make sense.

You don't extend a guy til 2014-2015 or beyond if you're planning on sending him to the AHL in 2013-2014, just so that he can be a #3 for a couple months.
 
hockeylover said:
I guess I don't really get arguing that a) Kiprusoff's pretty good, b) that Calgary's gonna give him to us for a good price AND c) eat most of his cap hit next year. They should just keep him if that's true, no?
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Phaneuf was pretty good, they gave him to us at a pretty good price, and they probably should have kept him........they didn't.


But on this point, would you think Nonis was a piece of shit had he acquire Kipper for relative peanuts, and either dealt salary in the deal (Liles?) or Calgary at a couple mill on his salary next year, and then he was signed to an extension at $1-2m per?

It'd definitely alter how I'd view it.

Like the assertion they'd be able to keep all three and that Kiprusoff could be sent to the Marlies, that scenario seems like a reach to me.
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Agreed....Kipper was never going to the Marlies.
 
BeLeafer, I agree with you on most things hockey related, but this "Nonis wanted to bring in Kiprusoff for this year, next year and extend his contract for a third year to play with the Marlies and be the Leafs third stringer" theory is one of the most nonsensical and flat out insane ideas I've ever seen espoused on this board by someone not named "teeder". I'm astonished that you're still flogging this idea.
 
Montana said:
Phaneuf was pretty good, they gave him to us at a pretty good price, and they probably should have kept him........they didn't.

Agreed....Kipper was never going to the Marlies.
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So you'd have to carry three goalies or lose Scrivens on waivers, no? See, I just don't see the point.
 
hockeylover said:
Of course I refuse to entertain it. It doesn't make sense.

You don't extend a guy til 2014-2015 or beyond if you're planning on sending him to the AHL in 2013-2014, just so that he can be a #3 for a couple months.
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That conclusion implies that Nonis is lying. Has he done one thing as GM that supports such of view of him? Any evidence of him saying one thing and doing another?

There's tons of evidence of him doing what he says and being very consistent with it.
 
Kipper has had 4 good years in his entire career and everyone bows to him.

He's one of the most overrated goalies ever and is almost entirely responsible for the Flames being consistently mediocre the last decade.

Nonis and the Leafs dodged a huge bullet.
 
Career Save Percentage of Current Starting Goalies:

C.Schneider: 90gms, .926
T.Rask: 127gmsm .925
J.Markstrom: 22gms, .921
H.Lundqvist: 498gms, .920
P.Rinne: 285gms, .920
B.Holtby: 48gms, .919
N.Backstrom: 356gms, .917
J.Hiller: 271gms, .917
J.Howard: 222gms, .917
J.Halak: 220gms, .917
A.Niemi: 291gms, .917
C.Price: 300gms, .916
R.Miller: 492gms, .915
C.Anderson: 309gms, .915
J.Quick: 277gms, .915
I.Bryzgalov: 418gms, .914
K.Lehtonen: 371gms, .914
S.Bobrovsky: 109gms, .914
M.Brodeur: 1210gms, .913
M.Smith: 255gms, .913
S.Varlamov: 142gms, .913
D.Dubnyk: 130gms, .913
J.Reimer: 93gms, .913
E.Nabokov: 636gms, .912
M.Kipper: 617gms, .912
B.Bishop: 36gms, .911
M.Fleury: 459gms, .910
C.Ward: 431gms, .910
O.Pavelec: 221gms, .907

and unlike some of the decent goalies around him in the standings there, he neither started his career from a very young age, nor is currently only a year or three into his career, nor played back in an era where lower save percentages were normal.
 
LeafGm said:
BeLeafer, I agree with you on most things hockey related, but this "Nonis wanted to bring in Kiprusoff for this year, next year and extend his contract for a third year to play with the Marlies and be the Leafs third stringer" theory is one of the most nonsensical and flat out insane ideas I've ever seen espoused on this board by someone not named "teeder". I'm astonished that you're still flogging this idea.
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Well, it's exactly what Nonis said he was doing. Page back ... 17 posted the quote.
 
hockeylover said:
So you'd have to carry three goalies or lose Scrivens on waivers, no? See, I just don't see the point.
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I suspect they'd have traded him, yes.


Which makes me wonder how much they believe in Scrivens........making the fact he turned down Scrivens + two 2nds for Luongo even more interesting.
 
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