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OT: American Politics

The money paid to researchers at Sick Kids and having or not having universal health care have nothing to do with each other that I can see. I think you're out to lunch.
 
theREALkoreaboy said:
ok. on one hand you appear to be admitting here that many of those advancements DO occur in the american system, on the other you appear to be denying that the makeup of that system had much to do with it. right.
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A lot of important research happens in the US...but typically at the university level, the same level at which most research happens in most countries. If we're talking pharma...well, a lot of the big pharma firms are european...and even for the US firms, the US is simply one market. A large market that they have significant pricing control over due to purchased political influence, but just one market.

But hey, if you think US insurance companies (you know, the guys making huge profit off) are on the cutting edge of medical R&D...you run with that champ. It's really the only portion of the U.S system that is foreign to how the rest of the world runs their health care systems.
 
theREALkoreaboy said:
are most american universities public or private? champ.
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The answer to which has nothing to do with healthcare. US private universities are among the best in the world...as are the top Canadian, European, Asian, etc...public universities.

Important research come out of all of them. The research coming out of the US universities would not be altered if the motive were not profit. In fact, for purely scientific & ethical reasons, there's a compelling argument to be made that it would be better...not so much time tied up in cock pills and cures for male pattern baldness getting in the way of cancer treatments.
 
don't understand what you guys are arguing about. advancements in technology, medicine, etc. will continue to take place in the private sphere.

you think that ER doctors and hospital administrators are discovering the cure for aids?

health reform isn't going to impact that. at all.
 
ME stop arguing with him about htis. he has spun an idiotic web that he can't get himself out of. but yo'ure just arguing on a tangent.

none of this has anything to do with health reform.
 
your arguments are wildly inconsistent. i'm bringing universities into this because you did. you said lots of research and innovation comes out of them. when i respond (accurately) that many of the best of those universities are private, you now say they have nothing to do with the system.

and now, you appear to be suggesting that those private universities fund research entirely out of the goodness of their hearts, and not because they feel it can help their bottom lines. batshit crazy.
 
The best part here is this...

He argues until he's blue in the face about his education system being best when it's in the hands of the government....but then holds up the ridiculously expensive American private university system (that has created one of the largest personal debt pits in US history, and is by itself a major impediment to the US getting out of this economic malaise) as something to be applauded.

The ironing...delicious.
 
MindzEye said:
The best part here is this...

He argues until he's blue in the face about his education system being best when it's in the hands of the government....but then holds up the ridiculously expensive American private university system (that has created one of the largest personal debt pits in US history, and is by itself a major impediment to the US getting out of this economic malaise) as something to be applauded.

The ironing...delicious.
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i have been very clear about why i think public education is entirely defensible. when you are dealing with children, who are mentally and legally incapable in most cases of making real choices for themselves, and where the stakes are as high as the continuation of our civilization, i think a largely PUBLIC education system is the best way to go. notice, i don't say ENTIRELY public, i say LARGELY public. contrary to the parrots in this flock who continue to try to paint me with the "he's against ALL gov't spending and ALL gov't programs" brush, i think public education is the very best, most desirable, most effective, and most important social program.
 
I don't see how health coverage is any less important. People are at their lowest when they are dealing with health issues. It seems to me that it is logical that compassion should come into play here. I don't think people should have to file for bankruptcy because they got sick. I don't think they should have to sell their home. You talk a lot about how people are so different today, so selfish and arrogant, but it can easily be argued that people are this way because the system makes them this way. When a politician can openly say that they have no issue that their friend died because they didn't have 100k to deal with health problems, there is something wrong there.
 
i think people should have choices. if i am a 20-something year old with no family, in perfect health, and i don't want a gold plated health package i think i should have some choice about how much health care i pay for. i am not saying the system should be entirely private, but i think an entirely one-payer system leads to rationing, wait times, and inefficiencies like we see here in this country.
 
theREALkoreaboy said:
i think people should have choices. if i am a 20-something year old with no family, in perfect health, and i don't want a gold plated health package i think i should have some choice about how much health care i pay for. i am not saying the system should be entirely private, but i think an entirely one-payer system leads to rationing, wait times, and inefficiencies like we see here in this country.
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As a 20-something year old with no family and in perfect health up until just recently, I really cringe when I read this. I'm sure this gets people into trouble in the States.
 
hockeylover said:
As a 20-something year old with no family and in perfect health up until just recently, I really cringe when I read this. I'm sure this gets people into trouble in the States.
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sure it does. it saves many millions more a lot of money. between a complete private free-for-all and a gov't controlled single-payer system, i think there's a happy medium to be found somewhere. harpycare and canada aren't it.
 
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