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OT: The Official Toronto Raptors Thread

No one can offer the picks package Presti can, and he doesn't really even have to give all of them. I do think Milwaukee should hold off until the summer to make the trade. Easier to make a trade work.
 
Yeah no way he gets traded this season. Those calf strains are so dangerous. Imagine giving up everything for Giannis just for him to tear his achilles? Ooof.
 
Don't see why OKC would want to upset their winning balance by moving key pieces. It's not like they're trying to get over the hump, they already won a title, they're currently 21-1, with a top 5 pick potentially incoming. It doesn't get much better than that. Giannis is great, but when you bring him in, he becomes a focal point and that could upset the cohesion they currently have.
 
PlayerToBeNamedLater said:
Don't see why OKC would want to upset their winning balance by moving key pieces. It's not like they're trying to get over the hump, they already won a title, they're currently 21-1, with a top 5 pick potentially incoming. It doesn't get much better than that. Giannis is great, but when you bring him in, he becomes a focal point and that could upset the cohesion they currently have.
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It's a tough decision to make for sure, but if you're not involved and you let SAS take a run at him and get him for, let's say:

- Castle
- Vassell
- Sochan
- Olynyk
- 2025, 2028 1sts

and you're now running into this in the WCF:

C - Wemby
PF - Giannis
SF - Johnson
SG - Harper
PG - Fox
6 - Barnes
7 - Champagnie
8 - Kornet

Plus whatever they scoop at the deadline for other random assets.

Your path to a repeat probably becomes something like this: Steph + Jimmy Warriors, the upgraded Nuggets, Wemby-Giannis spurs.

That would be the biggest motherfucker of a gauntlet any team in history would have to run. I think our 2019 gaunlet is massively underrated (Jimmy + Embiid Sixers, future champ Bucks, and a warriors team that was a mini dynasty even without KD) and that would make ours look soft.

There aren't many potential moves out there that a GM has to bother about playing defence on, but this is one of them. You don't want to be the #1 team in the west and let the up and coming young #4 team (only a game or two out of #2) get their hands on a perennial MVP candidate and one of the best 15-20 players of all time. That's a really good way to watch the dynasty window you've patiently created get smashed.
 
MindzEye said:
It's a tough decision to make for sure, but if you're not involved and you let SAS take a run at him and get him for, let's say:

- Castle
- Vassell
- Sochan
- Olynyk
- 2025, 2028 1sts

and you're now running into this in the WCF:

C - Wemby
PF - Giannis
SF - Johnson
SG - Harper
PG - Fox
6 - Barnes
7 - Champagnie
8 - Kornet

Plus whatever they scoop at the deadline for other random assets.

Your path to a repeat probably becomes something like this: Steph + Jimmy Warriors, the upgraded Nuggets, Wemby-Giannis spurs.

That would be the biggest motherfucker of a gauntlet any team in history would have to run. I think our 2019 gaunlet is massively underrated (Jimmy + Embiid Sixers, future champ Bucks, and a warriors team that was a mini dynasty even without KD) and that would make ours look soft.

There aren't many potential moves out there that a GM has to bother about playing defence on, but this is one of them. You don't want to be the #1 team in the west and let the up and coming young #4 team (only a game or two out of #2) get their hands on a perennial MVP candidate and one of the best 15-20 players of all time. That's a really good way to watch the dynasty window you've patiently created get smashed.
Click to expand...

Also have to remember Giannis is 30 years old, super expensive and his game might not age well because he relies heavily on his athleticism. OKC is super young and they should contend for the next decade so I wouldn't worry about a 2-3 year window without Giannis.
 
PlayerToBeNamedLater said:
Also have to remember Giannis is 30 years old, super expensive and his game might not age well because he relies heavily on his athleticism. OKC is super young and they should contend for the next decade so I wouldn't worry about a 2-3 year window without Giannis.
Click to expand...

He's 30, almost 31, yeah. But Chet is about to be almost as expensive as of July 1st and not remotely as impactful at any age.

Giannis aging curve probably puts him at having ~5 years left as a top player though, not 2-3. We're just seeing too many elite players stay really, really good into their mid-late 30's now to not plug it into our expectations for an all time talent like Giannis.

Also, I think you're overselling how young OKC is. Chet and Williams are pretty young (24 and 25 this summer respectively) but Shai is 28 this summer and he's the important one. iHart (28 by summer) & Caruso (32) are massively essential role player for their style of play as well. dEPM has Caruso as the best defensive player in basketball, and iHart as the 3rd-4th best centre in the league defensively. That's hard as fuck to replace and they don't get to keep that for much longer at all.

It's not age that impedes teams like this from staying together and being a dynasty long term anyway, it's cap structure. The cap is going to be about 166 million next season with the Luxury Tax set at about 200 million. Shai-Williams-Chet is set to make 144 of that. They then have another 36 million guaranteed in Caruso, Joe, Wiggins, Williams, Sorber, and Mitchell. Already at 180. Then team options on Dort, iHart, Topic and Cason totalling another ~65 million. Yeah, they're not spending 245 million next year mang. They already need to make some pretty significant changes to get down to 1st apron territory of ~210, so why not flip a bunch of it for an elite player that comes closer to guaranteeing a 3-5 yr dynasty than anything else would?
 
PlayerToBeNamedLater said:
Don't see why OKC would want to upset their winning balance by moving key pieces. It's not like they're trying to get over the hump, they already won a title, they're currently 21-1, with a top 5 pick potentially incoming. It doesn't get much better than that. Giannis is great, but when you bring him in, he becomes a focal point and that could upset the cohesion they currently have.
Click to expand...
Bingo , great post
 
Silver lining, on the positive side of things, once RJ Barrett is back this ingram hero ball will likely go away for a while. We miss his ability to drive to the rim from the wing, his ability to draw fouls with his physicality and score with authority. RJ is a rim finisher/offensive rebounder/bully crash and bang scorer and shooter.

Our offense runs through Scottie Barnes, he’s our quarterback on the court. He’s great at both ends of the court ( defense, offense, rebounding) When our offensive revolves around BI, it has no flow, purpose or ball movement. He’s a primarily an iso three level scorer, not a playmaker, play driver/caller, possession monster, or offense creator. He’s limited offensively, he can’t run offense and make plays for everyone.

It was a frustrating/annoying game tonight . The raps played well enough to win but failed to execute at the end. I expected that the refs would be always on the lakers side again and tonight was no different.

they're gonna demolish the hornets tomorrow at least

also I don't think Jamal shead has played well enough lately to deserve the minutes the coaching staff is giving him at this point, he doesnt score from 3 anymore and he isn't that good as a defender at all.

crazy to think but davion mitchell was maybe the point guard they should've kept in the end. He’s playing well on the Miami heat.
 
Ingram performance/scoring statistics in the last 4 games

10/26
4/11
7/17
10/23

Just unacceptable from your #1 scoring option/leading scorer . Add in 18 assists to 15 turnovers and it’s just been ugly and dont even get me started on his defense.
 
When this team is healthy, they’re very good. They are good as a collective unit. But as soon as one starter is missing/injured, everything falls off a cliff.

a chain is only as strong as its weakest link​

 
we traded the wrong point guard (Davion Mitchell) for nothing. IQ and Shead
Have been struggling and disappointing lately.

We need a another rim protector/big/power forward with rebounding ability and a 3&D player who can guard the perimeter well as a defender and who can shoot threes so bad

We gotta do better at guarding the 3pt line, the way we defend three point shooters reminds me of the nick nurse era. That Collapsing down the paint and conceding the perimeter strategy ain’t working.
 
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PlayerToBeNamedLater said:
Also have to remember Giannis is 30 years old, super expensive and his game might not age well because he relies heavily on his athleticism. OKC is super young and they should contend for the next decade so I wouldn't worry about a 2-3 year window without Giannis.
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Freaks body is breaking down , OKC doesnt need him to get over the hump
 
MindzEye said:
He's 30, almost 31, yeah. But Chet is about to be almost as expensive as of July 1st and not remotely as impactful at any age.

Giannis aging curve probably puts him at having ~5 years left as a top player though, not 2-3. We're just seeing too many elite players stay really, really good into their mid-late 30's now to not plug it into our expectations for an all time talent like Giannis.

Also, I think you're overselling how young OKC is. Chet and Williams are pretty young (24 and 25 this summer respectively) but Shai is 28 this summer and he's the important one. iHart (28 by summer) & Caruso (32) are massively essential role player for their style of play as well. dEPM has Caruso as the best defensive player in basketball, and iHart as the 3rd-4th best centre in the league defensively. That's hard as fuck to replace and they don't get to keep that for much longer at all.

It's not age that impedes teams like this from staying together and being a dynasty long term anyway, it's cap structure. The cap is going to be about 166 million next season with the Luxury Tax set at about 200 million. Shai-Williams-Chet is set to make 144 of that. They then have another 36 million guaranteed in Caruso, Joe, Wiggins, Williams, Sorber, and Mitchell. Already at 180. Then team options on Dort, iHart, Topic and Cason totalling another ~65 million. Yeah, they're not spending 245 million next year mang. They already need to make some pretty significant changes to get down to 1st apron territory of ~210, so why not flip a bunch of it for an elite player that comes closer to guaranteeing a 3-5 yr dynasty than anything else would?
Click to expand...
Freak will change the chemistry and I dont see 5 years of elite play left in that body that misses 15-20 games for years now

Retool and use that draft capital to fill the gaps on the cheap , I dont see Prest getting involved at all

Freak has a player option this summer and may exercise it forcing another team to extending him on a supermax

Add him to SGA may cost 140 alone
 
Then do nothing, let SAS get him and enjoy watching him and Wemby put you out in 6 in the WCF and ending your dynasty window.
 
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