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OT: World Politics

Pwner said:
Sure, but wait until Hinduism or Buddhism, or Islam, overtake Christianity as the dominant religion in the West.
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Why is this going to happen? I mean, if we're talking purely on demographic trends, no religion is going to overtake christianity as the dominant belief system long before any external religions get the chance.

Pwner said:
But come December, all one hears is Jesus.
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For real? As a borderline radical atheist married to an actual mexican catholic, living in about as traditional white a bedroom enclave as still exists in Canada, other than seeing a nativity scene or three, that's not my experience at all.
Pwner said:
Much better to wash your hands of it and let Christians celebrate however they want to, which has the side benefit of other religions, atheists, and Academia being left alone.
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Ehhh...we have much different opinions on not wanting the freedom of others to do their thing being left to the design of christians mate. I mean, if you're looking south and not absorbing that as the key takeaway, I'm not sure we're going to agree on much.
 
MindzEye said:
For real? As a borderline radical atheist married to an actual mexican catholic, living in about as traditional white a bedroom enclave as still exists in Canada, other than seeing a nativity scene or three, that's not my experience at all.
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Do you listen to the radio - CHFI has wall-to-wall Christmas songs, for example. Do you watch any TV commercials? How about any TV shows?
Now, a lot of that is about Santa and presents, but you also get "Joy to the world, the Lord is come." I know you can divorce Christ from Christmas, but do you?

MindzEye said:
Ehhh...we have much different opinions on not wanting the freedom of others to do their thing being left to the design of christians mate. I mean, if you're looking south and not absorbing that as the key takeaway, I'm not sure we're going to agree on much.
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Look, I am not a "Federalist Papers" scholar, nor have I read any of them (yes lol), but I did just Google "federalist papers freedom of religion" and Google's AI gave me this recap:

The Federalist Papers, while not explicitly focusing on religious freedom as a central theme, do touch on the concept within the context of a well-structured government and the protection of individual rights. They emphasize the importance of a multiplicity of interests and sects as a safeguard against tyranny, and they implicitly support religious freedom through their arguments for limited government and individual liberties.
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But the recap that I did want to focus on was this:

  • Multiplicity of Interests and Sects:
    Federalist No. 51, authored by James Madison, highlights the idea that a diversity of interests and religious sects within a society can act as a check on potential oppression. The more factions there are, the less likely any single one can dominate and infringe on the rights of others, including religious freedom.
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Now this comes in the backdrop of the Anglican Church allowing divorce and pushing out the Puritans. The Holy Roman Empire/ Catholic Church being literal King Makers, and Protestants moving to the New World. True, "sects" today can be construed as any religion, but Madison is not talking about Islam or Buddhism; he is talking about Anglicanism, Methodism, Catholicism, Protestantism, etc.
 
Pwner said:
Do you listen to the radio
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You mean, like old people? No.

Pwner said:
Do you watch any TV commercials? How about any TV shows?
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Are we having this discussion in 2025 or 1987? What are TV commercials?

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But what does any of this have to do with the modern context? In the modern context, there's an actual christian nationalist authoritarian movement going on just a bit south of us at the moment that are the dominant christian movement in north america. That's what "christian" society looks like in 2025

If we want to discuss the historic context, sure. The coles notes are pretty simple. The FF's cribbed basically everything from the French (Rousseau, Voltaire, etc, etc) who in fairness took a lot of their best ideas from Locke.....but none of it tracks back to christianity. It mostly tracks back to Greece. Organized Christianity stood in the way of secular philosophical advance, it didn't support it. It kicked and scream at every inch gained.
 
Pwner said:
Much better to wash your hands of it and let Christians celebrate however they want to, which has the side benefit of other religions, atheists, and Academia being left alone.
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Basically, what I was saying is that modern secularist societies, which are great!!, come out of the idea of not having Christian sects fight for control. Because we live in a "race-based" state. A Christian "race-based" state. Even our National Anthem has God in it. What about all the other religions that have multiple Gods?

With a better standard of living, more education, freedom to question, science, and our fact-based culture, plus tonnes and tonnes of hypocrisy, people are moving away from organized religion. Historically, that trend doesn't last, but who knows? I hear people say, "I am not religious, I am spiritual", ok.
 
MindzEye said:
You mean, like old people? No.
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Oh, right, you don't work in an office. I work from home now, but I did just a couple of years ago.

MindzEye said:
Are we having this discussion in 2025 or 1987? What are TV commercials?
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What? You don't watch live sports? Or Breaking News?

MindzEye said:
But what does any of this have to do with the modern context? In the modern context, there's an actual christian nationalist authoritarian movement going on just a bit south of us at the moment that are the dominant christian movement in north america. That's what "christian" society looks like in 2025.
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I laugh to myself when I think about their end game. So what would happen when they kick all the non-Christians out of the country? Who will get their version of the bible in Schools? How about the Ten Commandments? Are the Evangelical Protestants going to allow the Catholics any power? Are the Mormons going to fight with the Methodists? lol
 
Pwner said:
What? You don't watch live sports? Or Breaking News?
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On TV? No.

Seriously, "christian" holidays stopped being christian when capitalism replaced jesus with a fat norwegian and bunnies that lay chocolate eggs mate. Our western central religious figure is the dollar, not jesus.

Now...Mexico? That's a place where both holidays you mentioned are religious. The country basically shuts down for 10 days at Christmas and 1-2 weeks for semana santa (saints week) and the Hesus is fucking everywhere. What we do up here simply isn't that, or anything resembling that. Fuck, it would be kind of insulting to mexican catholics to even try to compare them.
 
Pwner said:
Basically, what I was saying is that modern secularist societies, which are great!!, come out of the idea of not having Christian sects fight for control. Because we live in a "race-based" state. A Christian "race-based" state. Even our National Anthem has God in it. What about all the other religions that have multiple Gods?

With a better standard of living, more education, freedom to question, science, and our fact-based culture, plus tonnes and tonnes of hypocrisy, people are moving away from organized religion. Historically, that trend doesn't last, but who knows? I hear people say, "I am not religious, I am spiritual", ok.
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nope.

We live in the most immigrant-friendly non-race non-culture based society the world has ever seen.

when the west was stuck in race-based ethnostates, it was called the dark ages.
 
Aww geez, so a couple of weeks of bombing & missiles led by strategic geniuses like Trump & Bibi didn’t permanently solve the question of the Iranian nuclear program?

And the Iranian people also aren’t on the verge of throwing out the Ayatollahs and inviting the idiot failson of the idiot Shah to resume his family’s inglorious reign over an Israel & America-friendly Iran?

Shocking. Simply shocking.
 
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