2024-25 NHL Misc. Thread
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So the Bananas…
It was OK. Weird seeing it in a football stadium, I’m sure the experience at the DBAP was much different and probably better. From the other reaches of left center field, some of the gags fell flat. It’s more baseball than the Globetrotters are basketball and there isn’t a lot of goofing off during play. A lot of choreographed dancing between innings or during play but the runner on first isn’t pulling the first baseman’s pants down. And the quality of the baseball isn’t that great. Think about how a baseball field would be situated on a football field. There should have been a ton of homers to right and right center. Even left field is reasonably close. There were 4 homers, one right down the left field line, the others to right or right center. So either they were intentionally trying not to hit one or they couldn’t. And a ton of homers would have been boring. The games have a 2 hour time limit, so there isn’t a lot of time between pitches. Players have to sprint to first if there is a walk and a couple of runners made it to 2nd base as the defense was doing the baseball equivalent of the Globetrotter’s weave. And it isn’t traditional baseball scoring, the teams get points for winning an inning. So if a team doesn‘t score in the top of an inning, the inning ends if there is a run scored in the bottom of the inning, no matter how many outs there are.
Overall, it was an enjoyable evening. Would I go again? Probably not and definitely not in a football stadium again. Now, back to hockey.
It was OK. Weird seeing it in a football stadium, I’m sure the experience at the DBAP was much different and probably better. From the other reaches of left center field, some of the gags fell flat. It’s more baseball than the Globetrotters are basketball and there isn’t a lot of goofing off during play. A lot of choreographed dancing between innings or during play but the runner on first isn’t pulling the first baseman’s pants down. And the quality of the baseball isn’t that great. Think about how a baseball field would be situated on a football field. There should have been a ton of homers to right and right center. Even left field is reasonably close. There were 4 homers, one right down the left field line, the others to right or right center. So either they were intentionally trying not to hit one or they couldn’t. And a ton of homers would have been boring. The games have a 2 hour time limit, so there isn’t a lot of time between pitches. Players have to sprint to first if there is a walk and a couple of runners made it to 2nd base as the defense was doing the baseball equivalent of the Globetrotter’s weave. And it isn’t traditional baseball scoring, the teams get points for winning an inning. So if a team doesn‘t score in the top of an inning, the inning ends if there is a run scored in the bottom of the inning, no matter how many outs there are.
Overall, it was an enjoyable evening. Would I go again? Probably not and definitely not in a football stadium again. Now, back to hockey.
HeyKurtz
Well-known member
Happened across this profile of the Bananas’ owner…
https://businessnc.com/gaston-countys-jesse-cole-is-going-savannah-bananas/
https://businessnc.com/gaston-countys-jesse-cole-is-going-savannah-bananas/
CanadaCanes
Well-known member
The man is a genius in regards to never giving up on a dream and understanding the importance of a fans first product. I watched some of it last night on ESPN and it definitely seems like more of an in person baseball stadium entertainment experience. I can see the intrigue to bringing the family out to see some Banana Ball live as a fun night out but I agree with Andy that it might be more of a one and done experience for many.
Nope. I never saw Meadowlark with his splinter team, but I DID see one of the games he played with the Globies when he came back for his reunion/retirement tour in the 90s. I saw the Meadowlark/Curly Neal/Geese Ausby version of the Globies when I was kid.
Pucking Lamplighter
Well-known member
My Dad was much more of a hoops guy then than he is today. He got us courtside seats to the Globetrotters in 1967, when I was 6 years old. Some of the confetti tossed out of the bucket landed on us from the water gag. I was sure we were going to get soaked. Curly Neal handed me the ball as he tied his shoe out of bounds in front of us. Cool memories & Thanks, Dad!
Jim
Jim
Jeez Hainsey ... throw in a "right" every so often.
Here's my question ... where's the beef exactly? People have cast a lot of loose aspersions at Vegas and Tampa but those complaints have been proven to be mostly sour grapes combined with a misunderstanding of how this all works. I support some kind of regulatory mechanism but this is WAY less of a competitive concern than something as basic as the deterioration of the standard of officiating and figuring out a logical, repeatable way to protect your goaltenders in the crease.
Here's my question ... where's the beef exactly? People have cast a lot of loose aspersions at Vegas and Tampa but those complaints have been proven to be mostly sour grapes combined with a misunderstanding of how this all works. I support some kind of regulatory mechanism but this is WAY less of a competitive concern than something as basic as the deterioration of the standard of officiating and figuring out a logical, repeatable way to protect your goaltenders in the crease.
CanadaCanes
Well-known member
I wish they would talk instead and take a closer look at the no state tax issue that some teams have been enjoying more and more. I know some of the pundits and media and even some of you guys in here will say there is no issue but that is going to continue to be a theme as the cap rises and these players and agents look to capitalize on every dollar by signing with teams with no state income tax. There is quite of bit of actual data already out there that clearly shows the distinct advantage these teams have when it comes to convincing free agents and players to sign there and enjoy that monumental savings over many other states/teams.
cmaleski2
Well-known member
There really isn't any simple solution to this. There probably is not a very good complicated solution either. For many people, a complete disregard or lack of understanding about how pro athletes on teams that travel are actually taxed just fuels this even more as those people simply take salary * state tax rate and say 'that is how much they will lose compared to if they played in Florida'. That isn't how it works.
The NHL obviously isn't going to get US states or Canada to change their tax rates. Agents seem to claim that at least for the big superstar contracts, state/city/provincial taxes are hardly a consideration. Who exactly are we leveling the playing field for? Toronto? New York? California? Chicago? Boo hoo to those teams, do they really need the league to help them offset their high taxes and costs of living?
To me this entire 'issue' is way overblown and also impossible to address. The league has more important issues to resolve. Not every high demand free agent can end up in a no tax state. Even with a rising cap, there is still a cap. There are way more things that factor into a free agent's decision than a few million saved in taxes. Are we going to try to balance those out too? The weather? The 'livability' of the city? The amenities or lack there of?
Do I think that Canada teams have a tax disadvantage? Sure! But they have a weather disadvantage too that I think is as much of a factor when UFAs are looking for landing spots. If you flipped the tax situations for Winnipeg and Florida, would top free agents flock to Winnipeg just because they can keep a few more million in their bank accounts? That warm weather and sandy beaches is a big deal for players and their families.
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Oh, it's overblown alright and it's WAY more complicated than 90% of people with strong opinions on the issue want to allow. For example, since players can easily get around the property tax and other fee issues by renting homes and leasing vehicles (which most of them do anyway), it's not as simple as figuring it will work out in the long run the same way it does for normally employed full time residents. Players in some markets (Philly, NY, NJ) can also choose to live in a different State than the one they compete in. Key word there being choose ... as in, it's not set in stone. For relatively itinerant, high income hockey with savvy investment panners, shaving that 2-3% or whatever they net out, is kind of a big deal ... but not the kind of big deal that keeps you from considering other options. That said, the combination of high local cost of living AND high national income taxes you get in Canada (and some US markets with high local taxes) IS enough to make plenty of players think twice about signing with a Canadian team. I honestly feel like THAT's the kind of thing that could be addressed in the CBA even if leveling the wild variety of State and Local taxes is maybe more trouble than its worth. It would pretty simple to index an average national income rate between Canada and the US with annual adjustments because there's only two data points.
Bottom line ... the tax disparity is nothing new and if it was that big a competitive problem you'd think it would have shown up a long time ago. It certainly hasn't helped Seattle, for example. And the Florida teams have sucked as much as they've been good over their history. Florida's current team is largely built on the fact that they sucked long enough to get 3-4 years of strong draft picks. Same with Edmonton, honestly. And Tampa. They all maximized their down cycles with good player development.
Bottom line ... the tax disparity is nothing new and if it was that big a competitive problem you'd think it would have shown up a long time ago. It certainly hasn't helped Seattle, for example. And the Florida teams have sucked as much as they've been good over their history. Florida's current team is largely built on the fact that they sucked long enough to get 3-4 years of strong draft picks. Same with Edmonton, honestly. And Tampa. They all maximized their down cycles with good player development.
And homeowners insurance, if they can find an insurer. My father was paying a fortune for homeowners insurance on a 1350 square foot ranch in West Palm Beach. And his insurer left the state, which gave me some anxiety after he passed. Fortunately, I was able to sell the house before the insurance lapsed. The property tax on that house is nearly $5,000, it has a taxable value of $250k. And that’s county taxes only, the property is outside the West Palm Beach city limits.
As for state income taxes, the biggest impact is on signing bonuses. We know he took less money overall, $63 million compared to $64 million. But of the $63 million total, less than $10 million is base salary; for 6 of the 7 years, his base salary is $1 million, it’s just under $4 million in 2026-27. The rest is signing bonuses, which won’t be taxed. If the Canes structured the 8x8 as all base salary, he’d have owed $180k per year in NC state income taxes (half of $8 million times the 4.50% tax rate)
cmaleski2
Well-known member
Back in the day, the Canadian government and the NHL actually subsidized NHL teams. The NHL gave them money because of the cratering Canadian dollar. The Canada government was trying to help teams out so they wouldn't move to the US.
This predates the lockout and salary cap system: https://www.espn.com/nhl/news/2000/0118/298393.html
TODAY? The Canada tax authority opens investigations on players like John Tavares who try to work the system to minimize their tax bites. I'm sorry, but if Canada really feels that their income tax setups are hurting their NHL team's competitiveness and care enough about it, the solution isn't to 'give them a higher salary cap' or 'reduce the cap for US teams in no state income tax states'. Canada can make a special tax reduction for NHL players income taxes to 'balance the Canadian teams' competitiveness'. How much money are we really talking about here? 140 players, say it costs the taxing authorities $1 million per player (very high estimate) to make the tax bite 'competitive'. That is $140 million. The Canada budget for 2025 is $7 Trillion. That is .002 % of the entirety of the federal budget.
Canada almost certainly is unwilling to do that. But shouldn't THAT be the solution if Canada feels that it's simply their high taxes that are hurting their chances for getting superstars to sign there? Even if they did make a new tax law for NHL players, again, back to my previous post, does anyone think that 'financials being equal', that a player is more likely to sign in Winnipeg, or Calgary, than Dallas, Miami, or Tampa?
If taxes are really a problem, it shouldn't fall on just the NHL to come up with a solution.
This predates the lockout and salary cap system: https://www.espn.com/nhl/news/2000/0118/298393.html
TODAY? The Canada tax authority opens investigations on players like John Tavares who try to work the system to minimize their tax bites. I'm sorry, but if Canada really feels that their income tax setups are hurting their NHL team's competitiveness and care enough about it, the solution isn't to 'give them a higher salary cap' or 'reduce the cap for US teams in no state income tax states'. Canada can make a special tax reduction for NHL players income taxes to 'balance the Canadian teams' competitiveness'. How much money are we really talking about here? 140 players, say it costs the taxing authorities $1 million per player (very high estimate) to make the tax bite 'competitive'. That is $140 million. The Canada budget for 2025 is $7 Trillion. That is .002 % of the entirety of the federal budget.
Canada almost certainly is unwilling to do that. But shouldn't THAT be the solution if Canada feels that it's simply their high taxes that are hurting their chances for getting superstars to sign there? Even if they did make a new tax law for NHL players, again, back to my previous post, does anyone think that 'financials being equal', that a player is more likely to sign in Winnipeg, or Calgary, than Dallas, Miami, or Tampa?
If taxes are really a problem, it shouldn't fall on just the NHL to come up with a solution.
perfectstormhits
Well-known member
Not surprising. He spent the entire season on LTIR after only playing 52 games last year.