• Moderators, please send me a PM if you are unable to access mod permissions. Thanks, Habsy.

Four Nations

axlsalinger said:
I wasn't specifically referring to Gretzky there, just that we were told there are well over 77 million Nazis in America right now, so the bar for entry probably isn't very high, is it? I know that is WeHave rhetoric, but I don't see too many people contradicting it either.

Anyway, I don't think we're all that far apart here. Gretzky is probably a dummy, likely a shithead, certainly a fucking coward for remaining silent, maybe he selfishly enjoys having access to the President but that doesn't make him a Nazi.
Click to expand...
There's no need to contradict my rhetoric because it makes perfect sense.

Donald Trump is a fascist. Ergo, anyone who votes for him, pals around with him, supports him, etc. is either also a fascist or is at least "fascist adjacent".

Fascist adjacent is when you don't see yourself as a fascist per se, but you see no problem with being around them and befriending them. Unfortunately for these "FA's", there is no such thing as "adjacent" to fascist and so these people, whether they like being called it or not, are, in fact, also fascists.

Perhaps if people and the media stopped using euphemisms like "MAGA", Evangelicals", "Trumpers", and the like and simply referred to them as what they are (i.e. fascists) some of them might give their life choices a second thought. It's not 2016 anymore. In 2025 you can't pretend you don't know what Trump is and rationalize voting for him by saying "Hey, I'm just here for the tax cuts." In 2025 you know damn well who and what he is and if you support any of that you're a fascist, full stop.

At least have the balls to own your bigotry.
 
worm said:
My guess is some ppl are trying to justify having maga friends and family they still talk to
Click to expand...
Your (and most liberals) mistake is believing that maga people are inherently bad people. Many are awful and hateful and are people I'd never associate with, but that doesn't mean they all are automatically trash.
 
Preston said:
Not sure how I got the reputation of being on the other side of arguments, we are all pretty like minded. We even agree that Gretzky is a piece of shit! The one time I have a slightly different take, the pile on happens. Which is par for the course here.
Click to expand...
Sure, okay Count, err, I mean Presto.
 
hockeylover said:
My MAGA family are kinda bad people tho tbh. A lot of it is stuff they repeat from Fox. But they don’t see a problem with blaming plans crashes on black people for example.
Click to expand...
Yeah those are the types that are just hateful, vindictive cunts. I've got some of those in my family. That's more common on the maga end for sure, but there are some libs like that too! WeHave is a perfect example.
 
worm said:
Must get confusing with all those alts

But really the argument is two fold. Guilt by association and whether annexing a country is a political leaning or not
Click to expand...
I'm past this debate, but I guess I struggle to see where Wayne supported the annexing.
 
Preston said:
Your (and most liberals) mistake is believing that maga people are inherently bad people. Many are awful and hateful and are people I'd never associate with, but that doesn't mean they all are automatically trash.
Click to expand...
Perhaps not on the surface, but if they are MAGA then they are, by definition, human garbage.

You're just giving us the "very fine people on both sides" argument again and it won't wash. You can't be just a little bit pregnant nor can you be just a little bit fascist. There is no such thing as someone who is only 10% fascist. If you're fascist at all you are 100% a fascist. I can't fathom why people want to pick fly shit out of the pepper here. It is a binary choice and there is no gray area, middle ground, or nuance to it.

Gretzky may be stupid and naive enough to believe that being Trump's buddy doesn't mean that he himself is a fascist but he's wrong. It means precisely that and he remains that unless or until he publicly repudiates Trump and atones for his transgressions.
 
Preston said:
Yeah those are the types that are just hateful, vindictive cunts. I've got some of those in my family. That's more common on the maga end for sure, but there are some libs like that too! WeHave is a perfect example.
Click to expand...
If forcing fascists to confront and own their bigotry is being a cunt then I am a proud liberal cunt.
 
Preston said:
Your (and most liberals) mistake is believing that maga people are inherently bad people. Many are awful and hateful and are people I'd never associate with, but that doesn't mean they all are automatically trash.
Click to expand...

I personally don’t have any friends that support Trump, but I was interested in learning about the group that are not MAGA but still voted for Trump…. and from what I can tell, those folks were more afraid of Kamala than Trump… mostly because they don’t want the country moving towards a European vibe (bigger government, more regulations, etc)

As appealing as Euro Capitalism sounds to us, a lot of folks see America differently (for better or worse). They like the promise of the winner take all, frontier vibe that American Mythology proposes.
 
MindzEye said:
Do you specifically mean a 1930's-40's era German National Socialist or the broader colloquial use of the word "nazi" which is often a stand in for a fascist authoritarian of various stripes?

Sure, he's not specifically a 1930's era german national socialist. But the latter? 100% is.
Click to expand...
Nazi's are defined by ideology, and Trump does not believe in any ideology, other than #Trump and $$$. There are a lot of people out there who might call Trump a Nazi, and if I asked what makes them think that, they would say Charlottesville. As we've seen, that isn't really fair. I told my family member he had some racist issues in the 70s, he said so did Joe Biden. That all goes to show that nothing is that simple.

He's the President of the United States, he is simply by the very nature of the job and everything it entails going to interact with many, many people every day. The fact that this many people voted for him in 2024 does suggest that this is quite possibly the dumbest timeline in the multiverse, but it doesn't mean they're all Nazis. I just find it hard to believe that all of us (except for WeHave, of course) can't agree that is simply lazy analysis.
 
Preston said:
Your (and most liberals) mistake is believing that maga people are inherently bad people. Many are awful and hateful and are people I'd never associate with, but that doesn't mean they all are automatically trash.
Click to expand...
I feel the majority of them are normal ppl that got brainwashed. I've repeated this plenty and with your fav topic of covid .

But if you are still a Canadian maga I definetly consider you anti Canadian and I do not need you in my life. I also think if you are racist, homophobic, etc that you are a bad person and that seems to be what a lot of vocal maga is.

Luckily I don't really have anyone close to me that is a Trumper. Lots of right wing ppl that are sickening by trump though.

I actually laugh at younger me arguing politics when it wasn't a matter of democracy or not.
 
axlsalinger said:
Nazi's are defined by ideology, and Trump does not believe in any ideology, other than #Trump and $$$. There are a lot of people out there who might call Trump a Nazi, and if I asked what makes them think that, they would say Charlottesville. As we've seen, that isn't really fair. I told my family member he had some racist issues in the 70s, he said so did Joe Biden. That all goes to show that nothing is that simple.

He's the President of the United States, he is simply by the very nature of the job and everything it entails going to interact with many, many people every day. The fact that this many people voted for him in 2024 does suggest that this is quite possibly the dumbest timeline in the multiverse, but it doesn't mean they're all Nazis. I just find it hard to believe that all of us (except for WeHave, of course) can't agree that is simply lazy analysis.
Click to expand...

All of those words without actually answering my question. Like I said, sure he's not specifically a Nazi (with a provided definition) but he is definitely a fascist authoritarian and no, Charlottesville isn't in the top 20 most compelling pieces of evidence as to why he is definitely a authoritarian fascist. For complete clarity, here's a solid working definition of the term fascist:

1740869145496.png

The only thing I'd really add to that is that fascism should probably include a blending or blurring of the lines between government and business/corporate power.

If you don't think Trump meets that definition above, I question what you've been paying attention for for the last 6 weeks.
 
CH1 said:
I personally don’t have any friends that support Trump, but I was interested in learning about the group that are not MAGA but still voted for Trump…. and from what I can tell, those folks were more afraid of Kamala than Trump… mostly because they don’t want the country moving towards a European vibe (bigger government, more regulations, etc)

As appealing as Euro Capitalism sounds to us, a lot of folks see America differently (for better or worse). They like the promise of the winner take all, frontier vibe that American Mythology proposes.
Click to expand...
Yeah I've got one friend that likes trump, and a bunch of family that are either maga or classic Republicans that vote trump because they have never voted Dem in their life. The trump friend is brainwashed, full stop. Not a hateful or angry person, but he genuinely believes that the swamp will be drained, doge will save the country, and he believes that trump is tough on other countries and that the US needs a strong leader like him (lol). Great guy though, would do anything for the people close to him. Better man than me.

My maga family is mostly trash and my republican family that voted trump basically had the same thoughts as you outlined.

I don't know, maybe it's my wop culture and the wop tendency to scream at each other one day and be best friends the next morning (not that I'm a screamer but it's what I've been around). Just because people see things differently than me, I don't immediately deem them bad people. And I like seeing different perspectives.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CH1
zeke said:
was Hitler actually ideological tho or did he just have a messiah complex
Click to expand...

I'd say he was clearly ideological about a number of things to the point of mythologizing them. Utilizing the power and authority of the state to enact those policies, venerate those things, and punish those who didn't belong was his main thing.
 
Preston said:
I'm past this debate, but I guess I struggle to see where Wayne supported the annexing.
Click to expand...
That isn't what the argument was though imo.

The Wayne related argument was just that he isn't against annexation while being a friend with annexation and is whining (through his wife) about him losing the respect of Canadians when he has the power to easily stop it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top