Leaf Rumours
- Thread starter Hoss
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Artnes
Well-known member
Nice to see a cool head around here.
Of any GM in the NHL, I can't imagine anyone would more embarrassed of how things turned out this season. Burke has a large ego and when its crushed the way it has been, he is taking it extremly personal. I know he is going to do and is doing everything in his power to fix this, but I just hope that, as someone mentioned earlier, Burke doesn't put ego ahead of common sense and make a big trade for the sake of change.
I still have confidence in him to fix this though
Of any GM in the NHL, I can't imagine anyone would more embarrassed of how things turned out this season. Burke has a large ego and when its crushed the way it has been, he is taking it extremly personal. I know he is going to do and is doing everything in his power to fix this, but I just hope that, as someone mentioned earlier, Burke doesn't put ego ahead of common sense and make a big trade for the sake of change.
I still have confidence in him to fix this though
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Hoss
Well-known member
yeah, you can't be a GM calling every week like some stalker girlfriend asking teams "so I still have Poni, hey he scored again this week" so what are we doing here?"
You throw stuff out early, and nearer the deadline teams look around and as long as they know those guys could be had, they will call. If you are calling them all the time, they will just try to take advantage.
Second, I am wondering if what they are saying about Stajan is true, and that he would like to remain with a paycut, I go to Stajan and say, I agree to pay you this much for this long.. however!! Go and be a rental to a team who may need you for a playoff run. If you want to come back then these are the terms. If you don't, I will understand, but I gotta build up the cupboards first.
Stajan would be a solid second line centre. Trade him, Poni, Grabs, Hags etc for 2nd round picks each or so. and then in the off season resign Poni, and Stajan as second line centre and wingers.
BUT GET SOMETHING FOR THEM NOW.
You throw stuff out early, and nearer the deadline teams look around and as long as they know those guys could be had, they will call. If you are calling them all the time, they will just try to take advantage.
Second, I am wondering if what they are saying about Stajan is true, and that he would like to remain with a paycut, I go to Stajan and say, I agree to pay you this much for this long.. however!! Go and be a rental to a team who may need you for a playoff run. If you want to come back then these are the terms. If you don't, I will understand, but I gotta build up the cupboards first.
Stajan would be a solid second line centre. Trade him, Poni, Grabs, Hags etc for 2nd round picks each or so. and then in the off season resign Poni, and Stajan as second line centre and wingers.
BUT GET SOMETHING FOR THEM NOW.
BG
Well-known member
Let's see:
Kessel (22)
Bozak (23)
Kulemin (23)
Stalberg (24)
Rosehill (24)
Grabovski (25)
Mitchell (25)
Schenn (20)
Gunnarson (23)
Gustavsson (25)
Which of these players has been held back? Which hasn't gotten a fair shake from the coach or GM? Who on the Marlies is still "young" and deserving of top six ice-time?
That "top-line" of Kulemin-Bozak-Kessel HAS to be the youngest in the league.. no?
BG
Well-known member
Burke went into this season with a playoff mission and few alternatives.
1. Playoff team - call up young guys for playoff run.
2. Bubble team - Sell vets at the deadline, call up the young guys.
3. Out of playoff contention - Sell vets at the deadline, call up the young guys.
1. Playoff team - call up young guys for playoff run.
2. Bubble team - Sell vets at the deadline, call up the young guys.
3. Out of playoff contention - Sell vets at the deadline, call up the young guys.
leafman101
Well-known member
Thats not surprising. I'd like to keep him and move Grabo. But then again, Kaberle and Hagman aside, Stajan will probably bring back the best pull in a deal.
number17
Mod Squad
Let's hope Stajan stays here ... for a number of reasons ...
1. He's a good 2nd / 3rd line center who's responsible defensively, and underrated offensively
2. He's very under-rated too, for trade value
3. He's a good character, always stays behind after ugly losses to face the media, stands up for his teammates on the ice and in front of media, and a good team player
4. He's a hard worker, who gives an honest effort every night despite his limitations, and a role model for young players to look up to
5. He's a local boy and a Leaf fan.
Stajan >> Grabo ... let's hope Burke keeps him and moves Grabo.
1. He's a good 2nd / 3rd line center who's responsible defensively, and underrated offensively
2. He's very under-rated too, for trade value
3. He's a good character, always stays behind after ugly losses to face the media, stands up for his teammates on the ice and in front of media, and a good team player
4. He's a hard worker, who gives an honest effort every night despite his limitations, and a role model for young players to look up to
5. He's a local boy and a Leaf fan.
Stajan >> Grabo ... let's hope Burke keeps him and moves Grabo.
number17
Mod Squad
And to be fair, the way the season's gone (which is Burke's fault, at least partially) has made it VERY DIFFICULT for Burke to make trades. Usually on a bad team you'd still have 1 or 2 guys playing well and you can at least fetch fair trade value for them. On ours, nobody's performed consistently, except Hagman and Poni who showed up recently.
leafman101
Well-known member
The cap has made it more difficult to make deals. Teams wait for the deadline these days. There hasn't been very many trades around the NHL this year.
There has only been 8 trades since the start of the season. And one of them WAS by the Leafs. There have really only bee 3 trades involving NHL roster players (Kobasew, Lats/Pouliot, and Clark/Chimera).
Its just not easy to make trades period until the deadline.
There has only been 8 trades since the start of the season. And one of them WAS by the Leafs. There have really only bee 3 trades involving NHL roster players (Kobasew, Lats/Pouliot, and Clark/Chimera).
Its just not easy to make trades period until the deadline.
Hoss
Well-known member
If Burke wants STajan to stay, it makes NO sense to keep him right now. This season is a wash. Trade him for something and then resign him in the off season.
Trade Grabo as well and put Stajan in as the second line centre. Stajan needs some playoff experience. Trade him to a playoff team and make that side deal for him to come back if he wants.
Same with Poni. Get something for him now.
Trade Grabo as well and put Stajan in as the second line centre. Stajan needs some playoff experience. Trade him to a playoff team and make that side deal for him to come back if he wants.
Same with Poni. Get something for him now.
MyNameIsJonas
Well-known member
The leafs are hardly in a position to let the chance of turning an asset into a pick/prospect pass them by.
It is better for the orginization to move Stajan and Poni now, rather then lose them for nothing or even signing them as you can likely find that kind of player in the free agent crop.
Ian White is another situation. If you decide that what he is asking for ( 3) makes no sense given the dynamics of your team then dealing him for a forward of the same caliber makes sense too.
Hagman and Grabo can be traded but since both have term left if you feel that your not getting fair value then you can hang on to them. ( like what was done with Poni and Stajan last year)
It is better for the orginization to move Stajan and Poni now, rather then lose them for nothing or even signing them as you can likely find that kind of player in the free agent crop.
Ian White is another situation. If you decide that what he is asking for ( 3) makes no sense given the dynamics of your team then dealing him for a forward of the same caliber makes sense too.
Hagman and Grabo can be traded but since both have term left if you feel that your not getting fair value then you can hang on to them. ( like what was done with Poni and Stajan last year)
LeafOfFaith
Well-known member
This is a good point, that most of us are overlooking.
Many of us want to keep Stajan and Poni in the fold because they're very good secondary players and, let's admit it, home grown Leafs.
We keep thinking of it in terms of 1) keep them, or 2) get something for them now and lose them.
But there's also the best of both worlds - 3) get something for them now AND keep them (via re-signing after July 1). Naturally, there's a risk inherent in this strategy: that we won't be able to get them back.
Given where this team is at, I think now that we should definitely take the risk. There's a possibility that Burke doesn't want them on the team next year, making this moot. But if he does, I think he should still take the risk of trading them and then trying to get them back in the offseason.
There's some good stuff coming back for those guys, even if worst case scenario is two 2nds. I'll take that. You never know when you get lucky and grab a first round talent late.
So yes, now I'm firmly on the trade them all bandwagon, even though getting rid of everyone would guarantee Boston the 1st overall pick most likely.
LeafOfFaith
Well-known member
LeafOfFaith
Well-known member
I'm certain that it's not just the buyers who are holding it up in our case, but Burke as well.
If he trades these guys earlier, we tank harder and make the Kessel trade look worse.
But if we keep them around till the last minute and squeeze out everything we can in the time we have them, then there should be a positive impact on our place in the standings.
Or at least that's the theory.
Thing is, after the Olympics, there is only one game played before the deadline, and I don't think Burke will care about what happens there.
I think he'll be active somewhat in trading a couple of guys before then. Or at least he should be, if he still pays attention to his day job and isn't worrying about team USA.
I mean, the real team USA, not the Leafs. Just to clarify.
I don't see how trading everyone makes the Kessel trade worse. We're 3rd last in the league and likely headed for 2nd. News flash, we can't get any worse! If anything we might have some players who are hungry to prove they belong in the NHL and might just surprise a few people.
LeafOfFaith
Well-known member
News flash. The higher that pick is, the better the player we gave up for Kessel (especially when you're talking about a top 3 pick potentially).
We now return to our regularly scheduled programming.
We now return to our regularly scheduled programming.
uncus
Well-known member
was just listening to MacLean and berger talking about the leafs and the trade deadline ....
Is this guy a fcking idiot or am I to stupid to realize that kaberle is barely worth a first and certainly not one in the first 15?
I couldnt believe that was his comment ...... no wonder this guy has no job in hockey management.
Is this guy a fcking idiot or am I to stupid to realize that kaberle is barely worth a first and certainly not one in the first 15?
I couldnt believe that was his comment ...... no wonder this guy has no job in hockey management.
leafman101
Well-known member
Thats not the reason. The reason is teams just aren't making trades now.
8 trades since October. Only 3 of them involving NHL players. Only one with anyone making any sort of money.
An unfortunate reality of the cap is it is near impossible to make deals mid-season until the deadline approaches.
8 trades since October. Only 3 of them involving NHL players. Only one with anyone making any sort of money.
An unfortunate reality of the cap is it is near impossible to make deals mid-season until the deadline approaches.
number17
Mod Squad
As for trading Stajan as a rental and have him re-signed in the summer. Well, anything's possible, but keep in mind while we all like to play the fantasy GM games, or make trades in NHL10, fact is these guys are people, with families, and with emotion. As a GM, you can hope to re-sign a player that you trade away at the trade deadline on July 1st, there is no guarantee that player will re-sign with you. The minute you trade a player away, especially a youngish player, you realize there's a moderate to high chance he'll trade all 30 teams the same on July 1st, and look at your offer no different than other offers.
So if we REALLY want Stajan, we should take advantage of his low market value right now and re-sign him now to a basement contract. You trade him, and your chance of having him back in your lineup next October is as good as the 29 other teams out there.
But if you're neutral on Stajan, and don't think it's a big loss even if he goes to another team then sure, trade him.
So if we REALLY want Stajan, we should take advantage of his low market value right now and re-sign him now to a basement contract. You trade him, and your chance of having him back in your lineup next October is as good as the 29 other teams out there.
But if you're neutral on Stajan, and don't think it's a big loss even if he goes to another team then sure, trade him.