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New Canadian Politics Thread

Preston said:
they've got nothing other than acting condescending and obnoxiously like the smartest person in the room.
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My algo keeps trying to bait me with obvious morons talking down to people (fucking liberals, naturally) who disagree with them on policy now.
 
zeke said:
at the same time, this is all aided by Trump exposing the modern right for what it is.

without that, we'd be screwed.
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Yeah, before that, anyone in the Canadian political center who felt that the LPC had moved too far away from them under Trudeau, or who were sick of Justin and just wanted any kind of change was generally willing to squint at PP and pretend that he was a bog-standard traditional Canadian Conservative who was good enough simply by virtue of not being Trudeau or Singh.

And they were helped along in this by Postmedia making a concerted effort for 1-2 years to sane-wash his image prior to him running for the leadership.

PP also aided on this by getting himself a photogenic wife from central casting, ditching his glasses, buying a blow-dryer & a bunch of hair gel and developing some biceps. And ducking and weaving, or resorting to outright mockery whenever anyone tried to pin him down on his Trump-adjacent far-right views.

But then Trump came along and made it impossible to keep walking that tightrope without coming down on one side or the other.
 
axlsalinger said:
I would push back at some of these points, universities are not simple "liberal" end of story, a lot of people there (not all) value intellectual honesty, thought-provoking debates, and great ideas no matter where they come from. And conservatives have had plenty of great ideas over time, the left is not right on every issue. However - in this day and age of MAGA that is not the case very often, is it?

I think the Euros are generally on the right track re: crime and the focus on reducing it, and we're not far behind, but sure, we should get tougher on violent crime and the worst offenders. And our immigration model was certainly imperfect and needed to be re-assessed and modified.

But your last point is the best, after getting blown out in the election the PCs should have regrouped to try and regain the support of folks like you. Starting by understanding how and why they lost you in the first place.

I am honestly quite surprised that PP and the cons have doubled and tripled down on anti-intellectualism and MAGA idiocy, rather than wising up to what the people want. And that is honesty and authenticity - PP tweeting about a massive downturn in the economy minutes before data is released showing the opposite is a great example. Acknowledge the threat of Trump/MAGA, and understand the political reality that things have changed, and that Carney is much more centrist and pragmatic. Be real with people, and they will respond in kind. The reality is that Carney is skilled and extremely popular. They don't have to like it, but they have to understand and acknowledge it before they can move forward. Placing their heads in the sand will get them nowhere.

What they have done since the last election is the opposite of what I would have advised, and expected. This is the result.
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I’m not a ‘conservative’ in my values. I get labeled that by my NDP friends and relatives. They are super dooper left and I’ve just adopted the word ‘conservative’ as a shorthand. If at all, my ’conservativism’ aligns with the late Canadian Philosopher George Grant…
 
axlsalinger said:
I would push back at some of these points, universities are not simple "liberal" end of story, a lot of people there (not all) value intellectual honesty, thought-provoking debates, and great ideas no matter where they come from. And conservatives have had plenty of great ideas over time, the left is not right on every issue. However - in this day and age of MAGA that is not the case very often, is it?

I think the Euros are generally on the right track re: crime and the focus on reducing it, and we're not far behind, but sure, we should get tougher on violent crime and the worst offenders. And our immigration model was certainly imperfect and needed to be re-assessed and modified.

But your last point is the best, after getting blown out in the election the PCs should have regrouped to try and regain the support of folks like you. Starting by understanding how and why they lost you in the first place.

I am honestly quite surprised that PP and the cons have doubled and tripled down on anti-intellectualism and MAGA idiocy, rather than wising up to what the people want. And that is honesty and authenticity - PP tweeting about a massive downturn in the economy minutes before data is released showing the opposite is a great example. Acknowledge the threat of Trump/MAGA, and understand the political reality that things have changed, and that Carney is much more centrist and pragmatic. Be real with people, and they will respond in kind. The reality is that Carney is skilled and extremely popular. They don't have to like it, but they have to understand and acknowledge it before they can move forward. Placing their heads in the sand will get them nowhere.

What they have done since the last election is the opposite of what I would have advised, and expected. This is the result.
Click to expand...
As for conservative voices in Universities, I think they are important. You never see the works of Thomas Sowell or Coleman Hughes or John McWhorter in universities when it comes to the debate on race for example. Douglas Murray, whose work I don’t always agree with has points on the more radical versions of Islam and its comparability with western liberal democracy is at time very interesting. And Tom Holland’s opus “Dominion’ an his views of Christianity are well thought out and very smart but for the most part universities these days are diploma factories that have experienced intellectual capture by the Chicago School and really shitty interpretations of Foucault, Derrida and Lyotard. And the anti colonial revisions of history leave out a lot of truth in favor of narratives that disrupt and degrade the very institutions that allow them to exist.
 
Stinky said:
I’m not a ‘conservative’ in my values. I get labeled that by my NDP friends and relatives. They are super dooper left and I’ve just adopted the word ‘conservative’ as a shorthand. If at all, my ’conservativism’ aligns with the late Canadian Philosopher George Grant…
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Being center left, or center right, is pretty similar. However, the differences become vast the further in each direction that you go.
 
zeke said:
Obviously i disagree with some of the things you argue here, but the fact that you're able to rationally make the case why they don't justify blanket anti-lib politics, and that there are either priorities at stake, is too encouraging to even try to argue them.

I don't doubt that there is validity to the concerns you have here and that you have good reasons to believe and pursue them.
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I’m happy to agree to disagree on things here.
Carney is going to be the most important PM since Mackenzie King. In my mind the nation builders are MacDonald, Laurier, King and Carney.
Then Pierre
Everybody else…
Then Young Trudeau.
Then Clarke
Then the lady…
 
Stinky said:
I’m happy to agree to disagree on things here.
Carney is going to be the most important PM since Mackenzie King. In my mind the nation builders are MacDonald, Laurier, King and Carney.
Then Pierre
Everybody else…
Then Young Trudeau.
Then Clarke
Then the lady…
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I am not sure that the lady accomplished much other than the biggest margin of defeat in my lifetime.
 
LeafGm said:
The CPC bleeding conservative voters such as yourself to the Carney Liberals is an excellent demonstration of how the party in its current form is well and truly lost.

Carney’s out there being an experienced, competent Progressive Conservative PM running a true big-tent party, and the CPC is a coterie of unserious & unqualified influencers, cranks, dorks, grifters, sloganeers and rage-farmers that are still inordinately preoccupied with not offending the Maple MAGA wing of the party or the members of the tiny online far-right bubble they inhabit.
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Justin pushed me to the right. I’m a centrist. Young Turdrope was terrible. I actually have my blood boil at the thought of some of his policies that though they had good intentions, they’re classist arrogance and i fucking hate him. Nepo baby.

I think Carney is a pragmatic Centrist. I used to be a pragmatic Leftist until the NDP became the party of actual ‘race cards’. They, and their last conference was a fucking joke. I’ve voted NDP, PC liberal and for Mel Hurtig in my lifetime.
 
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