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OT: American Politics

"Bear arms" itself was a term only used to describe military service.

Going hunting was not "bearing arms".

Heller was not just an interesting dispute, it was an egregious joke of a ruling on every level. And America is paying the price.
 
zeke said:
Sure, but the "well-regulated" militia referred to in the constitution was meant as the actual army itself, not as a defense against it. And in fact as you can see in there the fact that the federal government had the ability to call on state militias was almost as big an issue for them as having a standing federal army at all.
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State militias and the army are intentionally separated in the constitution. Article 2, on presidential powers, specifically mentions both. The second amendment prevents the feds from regulating away the states rights to have an armed militia.

Agreed, that the constitution grants the president the power to call upon the states militias, but once you have the guns and troops you have the ability to refuse orders you don't like. Which I think was the point ultimately. The principal is it is one union, but we get to keep our guns just in case. And we saw it play out in the civil war. They just said "fuck your constitution we have guns."

Thats my interpretation anyway.
 
zeke said:
sure they are.

Federalist Paper No. 29 is an essay by Alexander Hamilton, the twenty-ninth of The Federalist Papers. It was published in The Independent Journal on January 9, 1788 under the pseudonym Publius,[1] the name under which all The Federalist papers were published. It is titled "Concerning the Militia". Unlike the rest of the Federalist Papers, which were published more or less in order, No. 29 did not appear until after Federalist No. 36.

Hamilton states that a well-regulated militia composed of the people will be more uniform and beneficial to the "public defense" of Americans. He argues that an excessively large militia can harm a nation's work force, as not everyone can leave their profession to go through military exercises. Thus, a smaller, but still well-regulated militia, is the answer. In the end, Hamilton concludes that the militia, as it is constituted directly of the people and managed by the states, is not a danger to liberty when called into use by other states to do things such as quell insurrections.



Nothing about "defending against the tyranny of a federal government" in there.
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Hamilton. That's the black guy, right?
 
hockeylover said:


They’ve lied twice now about this one aspect.
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They clearly aren't equipped for this kind of event. Uvalde is a town of 15,000 people. How many officers do they even have? Thats probably why they needed border patrol.

Its totally unrealistic to expect small town police forces to be the good guys with guns that stop all bad guys. Gotta help them out. Can't just give mentally ill kids guns and free reign and tell Uvalde police department to handle it.
 
leafman101 said:
They clearly aren't equipped for this kind of event. Uvalde is a town of 15,000 people. How many officers do they even have? Thats probably why they needed border patrol.

Its totally unrealistic to expect small town police forces to be the good guys with guns that stop all bad guys. Gotta help them out. Can't just give mentally ill kids guns and free reign and tell Uvalde police department to handle it.
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Yes. Any police service is going to do poorly vs that firepower IMO. But they also used police tactics that haven’t been a thing in 20 years.

And my post was about police blatantly lying about a mass shooting timeline. Multiple times.
 
leafman101 said:
They clearly aren't equipped for this kind of event. Uvalde is a town of 15,000 people. How many officers do they even have? Thats probably why they needed border patrol.

Its totally unrealistic to expect small town police forces to be the good guys with guns that stop all bad guys. Gotta help them out. Can't just give mentally ill kids guns and free reign and tell Uvalde police department to handle it.
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Scroll back a few pages.

That town of barely 16,000 spends 40% of its civic budget on the police department and even has its very own SWAT team.

The taxpayers of Uvalde didn't get much bang for their buck this week.
 
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