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OT: World Politics

leafman101 said:
but the reports were that Hamas walked away from the Egypt talks because Egypt was demanding they surrender control of Gaza. Also that Saudis and UAE are pressuring Abbas to disband PA to install a Palestinian govt favourable to Saudi.
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this would be very good. especially the 2nd one.
 
LeafGm said:
I dunno. I’m still personally of the belief they should keep going until Hamas as an organization has been annihilated.

Would be better if that came about from Hamas surrendering unconditionally, their fighters laying down their arms and all of their senior leadership and the fighters who took part in their terrorist attack taken into custody.

If not, keep the military action going until they’re either all dead or captured.
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You're never going to kill or capture all of Hamas and even if you did you'd only be getting the current members. Unfortunately, every Hamas member you kill creates 2 new members dedicated to avenging the one you just killed. Israel is trying to enact a "Carthaginian peace" in Gaza but this ain't Carthage and it isn't 200 BC either.
 
Wayward DP said:
really, Bibi needs to resign. which isn't going to happen, but that is the best thing that could happen on the Israeli side IMO.
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this is another thing that's worrying me - Bibi has to think that if he backs down now, he's toast politically for sure.

He's probably toast either way, but it sure seems like he really really needs a huge Win here for his political survival, and that's scary if it's his motivator now.
 
WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou said:
You're never going to kill or capture all of Hamas and even if you did you'd only be getting the current members. Unfortunately, every Hamas member you kill creates 2 new members dedicated to avenging the one you just killed. Israel is trying to enact a "Carthaginian peace" in Gaza but this ain't Carthage and it isn't 200 BC either.
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Sure, it’s never going to be possible to completely destroy or kill off any terrorist organization.

But what do you suggest? After the October 7th attack, it’s untenable for Hamas to be left in place as the legitimate governing authority of one of Israel’s neighbours.

At the very least, what was done to ISIS has to be done to Hamas—ruthlessly and repeatedly decapitate the organization, degrade their capabilities, seize their assets, chase them out of the areas they control and drive their terrified remnants from one underground hideout to the next in constant fear for their lives.
 
If anything this probably bought Bibi time. His grasp on power was tenuous, but domestic politics is not on the top of Israelis minds after October 7.

And I don’t really think the response would be drastically different with any different leader.
 
leafman101 said:
If anything this probably bought Bibi time. His grasp on power was tenuous, but domestic politics is not on the top of Israelis minds after October 7.

And I don’t really think the response would be drastically different with any different leader.
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Which makes me think that he chose to ignore those warnings about an impending attack on purpose. It's Machiavellian but then again Bibi is a fascist when all is said and done. I don't think he'd hesitate one second to sacrifice a few of his own people to further his own ends and/or save his own ass. And if Hamas didn't already exist, Bibi would invent it. He's certainly done more to swell its ranks than any Israeli leader who came before and I don't think it was accidental. Like all fascists, Bibi needs a boogeyman with which to scare people.
 
zeke said:
this is another thing that's worrying me - Bibi has to think that if he backs down now, he's toast politically for sure.

He's probably toast either way, but it sure seems like he really really needs a huge Win here for his political survival, and that's scary if it's his motivator now.
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Second front against Hezbollah…
 
zeke said:
yes fuck hamas for sure.

but is Israel accomplishing a net positive for themselves here?
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Israel’s only issue here is a perception that they don’t give a shit about. War is ruthless and they’re trying to sever the nerve centre of the baddies.
 
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