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The New Division

leafman101 said:
Well there is a massive gulf. There is a massive gulf with the top players in the league and everyone else. Thats how they are so dominant.

Max Pac is ACTUALLY a 35/70 guy and he isn't anywhere near as good as Kessel, and I hight doubt you'd hear reasonable Habs fans say otherwise.
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How is Pacioretty a 35/70 guy when he hasn't hit either of those thresholds? Ever.
 
corksens said:
It's a pretty simple question.

Do you think Ryan will hit around 55 points next season? Is that the player you think he is.
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I think that is the player he has been. Actually no, that is the player he has been.

Like any young, skilled guy he has potential and room to grow. Not Kessel potential mind you.
 
Max Pac has undeniably been a better player than Bobby Ryan over the last two NHL seasons. And he has also been undeniably a lot worse than Kessel.
 
corksens said:
Early overall pick, multiple 30+ goal seasons, shoot first, no SH time.

Sounds alot like Kessel until he caught fire playing top-line minutes and top-PP time with the Leafs.
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Heh. "Sounds a lot like Kessel until Kessel became a way better player".

And Kessel isn't a shoot first guy anymore. He was top 5 in assists. Thats why Bobby Ryan doesn't have Kessel potential. He's a great goal scorer.

Kessel evolved as a player. Bobby Ryan didn't have the talent to.
 
leafman101 said:
Heh. "Sounds a lot like Kessel until Kessel became a way better player".

And Kessel isn't a shoot first guy anymore. He was top 5 in assists. Thats why Bobby Ryan doesn't have Kessel potential. He's a great goal scorer.

Kessel evolved as a player. Bobby Ryan didn't have the talent to.
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You said Ryan was never expected to be - would the same be said for Kessel?
 
Well considering Kessel was labeled the "Ameican Crosby" at 15/16 and Bobby Ryan was another American player the exact same age that would be a pretty big no.

Bobby Ryan was never in his class. Never will be. Sorry, just the facts.

Only Sens fans would be silly enough to hope otherwise.
 
We're going by labels at 15/16 now? Kessel has never come close to Crosby production...some prediction.

They've always been the same class of player - only until the past year and a half has there been any separation between the two. Sorry, just the facts.
 
By the way - any Leaf fan want to take a $100 bet on Ryan. Over under on 60 points?

He's only a 55 point guy, afterall, right?
 
corksens said:
Re-framing debates is what this board does.

If you think Ryan is a 35/35 guy then he's not far off of a 35/45 guy like Kessel.

You guys list the two year splits as if that is the player Ryan is. I think it's inaccurate. There is a shortened season in there for starters, and then of course I believe that one bad season can skew things too heavily.

I'm not saying Ryan is equal to Kessel - I'm just saying that there isn't some massive gulf like this board suggests.
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Kessel played close to a 90 point pace last year.

There's still a big difference between the two players, even if your hope that Ryan becomes a 70 point player comes true.
 
corksens said:
Early overall pick, multiple 30+ goal seasons, shoot first, no SH time.

Sounds alot like Kessel until he caught fire playing top-line minutes and top-PP time with the Leafs.
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You realize that I've already proven this line of argument false, right? I've shown you that Kessel produces significantly more on a per minute basis than Bobby Ryan, and with lesser linemates.
 
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