New Canadian Politics Thread

[Altair]

With that said, with the premier of toronto in charge at queens park, I think Quebec will be seen as the stable, sane and responsible provincial government in central Canada, regardless of who wins the election in October.

 

[anne25]

Ottawa has 23 councillors, with less than half of the population of toronto, yet ford says he has no plans to change the number of councillors in ottawa.

Very much a settling of scores by a scorned politician.

In some ways it is hard to compare the representations needs of the two cities, Ottawa is about three times larger than Toronto in area and and has a very large rural area with vastly different problems and needs needs than the urban parts of the city. As well, the city of Ottawa has to coordinate many issues and activities with the federal government and NCC.

That being said, I wouldn't complain if the urban part of council was trimmed a bit.

 

[MindzEye]

Whatever the appropriate number of councillors is, it's for the people of Toronto to sort out. Not a Premier with an obvious axe to grind.

 

[anne25]

Whatever the appropriate number of councillors is, it's for the people of Toronto to sort out. Not a Premier with an obvious axe to grind.

I agree.

 

[UWHabs]

Whatever the appropriate number of councillors is, it's for the people of Toronto to sort out. Not a Premier with an obvious axe to grind.

I honestly don't overly care if Doug lays down the law and wants 25 councillors. What I have a problem with is changing the rules partway through the race. You've got people who have been out campaigning for a month or more, have quit jobs, and suddenly you change all the rules?

If he wants it he can bring it in for next time. That's fair. But you don't change the rules in the middle of an election.

 

[Altair]

I honestly don't overly care if Doug lays down the law and wants 25 councillors. What I have a problem with is changing the rules partway through the race. You've got people who have been out campaigning for a month or more, have quit jobs, and suddenly you change all the rules?

If he wants it he can bring it in for next time. That's fair. But you don't change the rules in the middle of an election.

This is what liberal voters get when they refuse to jump from a sinking ship.

 

[zeke]

I haven't delved into the machinations and voting effects and real motivations of this move, but toronto does have too many councillors.

 

[MindzEye]

I honestly don't overly care if Doug lays down the law and wants 25 councillors.

.

I do. While it is technically within the scope of his power, he neither ran on it as a policy plank (which to be fair, he didn't release a platform, so yeah) nor is it something that the Premier of the province should be worrying about in the middle of a trade war, general financial problems, historic roll out of legal marijuana, etc, etc, etc. If you made a list of Ontario's problems, how many councillors Toronto has doesn't make the list, yet it was damn close to the first thing Dougie decided to act on.

The 20,000 foot view of this is that the new Premier is using his new position to settle a bunch of personal political beefs from his days on Toronto city council. That's concerning on a lot of levels.

What I have a problem with is changing the rules partway through the race. You've got people who have been out campaigning for a month or more, have quit jobs, and suddenly you change all the rules?

I honestly think you have this backwards. The timing of this is unfair, but it's the secondary problem. Abuse of power is a far bigger issue than abusing power at an inopportune time for the abusees

 

[MindzEye]

I haven't delved into the machinations and voting effects and real motivations of this move, but toronto does have too many councillors.

Based on what exactly?

45 on the council in a city of 3 million strikes me as reasonable. Western Canadian cities get away with fewer, but tbh, having lived in Calgary for a few years now, they do a pretty shit job delivering services.

 

[Altair]

I haven't delved into the machinations and voting effects and real motivations of this move, but toronto does have too many councillors.

45 councillors is around what most cities of torontos size use

 

[Altair]

"Premier Doug Ford’s bombshell move to cut the size of Toronto city council nearly in half is a win for the suburbs, one sure to penalize people living in the downtown core, say political experts.

“The media keeps calling this a reform. That’s a mistake,” said Roger Keil, a professor and former director of the City Institute at York University. “This is gerrymandering: changing political boundaries in order to favour the party in power. It is a very blatant attempt to change the rules of the game so the opposition can’t win.”

In the current 44-seat council, suburban councillors held the balance of power, said Evrim Delen, a political consultant and former campaign staffer for 2014 mayoral candidate David Soknacki. After a four-year consultation, Torontonians were poised to elect 47 councillors this October in a redistricting that would add three downtown seats and equalize downtown and suburban representation.

“The 25-seat council definitely takes us back to the suburban advantage,” Delen said. “It brings us back to the time of downtown under-representation.”

The four-year consultation that recommended a 47-seat council dismissed the 25-seat option because downtown wouldn’t have enough representation. City staff explored adding a 26th downtown ward, but this plan was dismissed because it “does not achieve voter parity” and “capacity to represent” — or the number of constituents per city councillor — would be “reduced significantly,” according to the final report of the Toronto Ward Boundary Review."

https://www.thestar.com/news/city_h...de-play-out-in-a-25-seat-toronto-council.html

For anyone who thinks Canada is above gerrymandering.

Toronto, biggest city in the country, is going to be ruled by ford nation for a long time.

 

[Altair]

https://www.thebeaverton.com/2018/0...uncil-size-by-killing-1-million-torontonians/

TORONTO – Ontario Premier Doug Ford will be reducing the number of elected municipal representatives in Toronto by culling over a million of its residents.

47 councillors for approximately 2.8 million people is too large, according to the province, and population cuts will have to be made.

“Toronto will run much more effectively if fewer people existed,” said Ford. “To clarify, I’m not being vindictive against my former colleagues by eliminating their constituents and pitting council allies against one another in an election…if they survive the population redistribution.”

When asked why Ford is only reducing the number of representatives (and therefore people) in Toronto, and not in any other Ontario municipality such as Ottawa, Mississauga, or Hamilton, Ford replied by ordering the execution of the journalist who asked the question.

The premier will announce which wards will be eliminated, and which ones voted for him.

Sources say the culling will be carried out by the provincial healthcare system once the government finds its ‘efficiencies.’

 

[Altair]

https://nationalpost.com/news/polit...t-canadians-poll-suggests?video_autoplay=true

Donald Trump must truly be a unholy nightmare for Trudeau and the Liberals.

With Donnie pushing all those migrants out of the US and into Canada, he has found a way to unite Canadians of all political backgrounds together.

According to the new survey from the Angus Reid Institute, two thirds of respondents believe that Canada has taken in too many irregular asylum claimants for authorities to manage, including majorities of Conservative, Liberal and NDP voters.

65 percent of Canadians, 84 percent of conservatives, 56 percent of Liberals, and 53 percent of NDP voters believe that the amount of illegal migration is too much for Canada to handle.

0 Percent of conservatives(ZERO!) 10 percent of Liberals and 9 percent of NDP believe it's a small number and Canada can handle more.

Those are some hideous numbers right there, and to boot

"Recent survey results from Abacus Data also found that among voters who want a change in government, immigration and refugees ranked as the second reason they’re dissatisfied, behind deficits and debt."

Major weak point for the Liberals, who have completely bungled this issue. And I guess it puts to rest the idea that Canadians are any better than Americans when it comes to illegal border crossings.

 

[Wayward DP]

https://nationalpost.com/news/polit...t-canadians-poll-suggests?video_autoplay=true

Donald Trump must truly be a unholy nightmare for Trudeau and the Liberals.

With Donnie pushing all those migrants out of the US and into Canada, he has found a way to unite Canadians of all political backgrounds together.



65 percent of Canadians, 84 percent of conservatives, 56 percent of Liberals, and 53 percent of NDP voters believe that the amount of illegal migration is too much for Canada to handle.

0 Percent of conservatives(ZERO!) 10 percent of Liberals and 9 percent of NDP believe it's a small number and Canada can handle more.

Those are some hideous numbers right there, and to boot

"Recent survey results from Abacus Data also found that among voters who want a change in government, immigration and refugees ranked as the second reason they’re dissatisfied, behind deficits and debt."

Major weak point for the Liberals, who have completely bungled this issue. And I guess it puts to rest the idea that Canadians are any better than Americans when it comes to illegal border crossings.

...what makes you say that?

 

[Altair]

...what makes you say that?

When 67 percent of Canadians, of all political backgrounds, think that the current situation is a crisis, and 33 percent believe it's being overblown by politicians and the media, and it is the second most important election issue, only behind the debt and deficit, it pretty much says that Canadians, like Americans, have no patience for those who enter the country illegally.

And considering that Americans are dealing with somewhere around 30 000 illegal migrants entering the country a month, and Canada is dealing with something around 1900 illegal migrants a month, based off of population, America takes in more per capita illegal migrants than Canada does, but Canadians are of the opinion that the current situations constitutes a crisis. It shows that Canadians are not any more tolerant of illegal migration than Americans are, in fact, maybe even less tolerant of it. We may not be putting them in cages and separating kids from their parents (at least not the Liberals government, who knows what a CPC one would do) but that doesn't mean we are any more accepting of them coming into Canada.

 

[Wayward DP]

where are you getting your numbers from?

you also seem to like to jump to conclusions. the data available to me does not lead me to the same conclusion you have reached. that conclusion may be true, but not based solely on the limited information you have presented.

Canadians becoming concerned with unauthorized border crossings is not at all the same as the 'deerrrrp build the wall' attitude down south (yes, I recognize not everyone supports the wall. but enough do).

also, it is only the second most important issue among those who want a change in government. you are letting the numbers tell you what you want them to.

 

[Altair]

where are you getting your numbers from?

I grabbed the US numbers from the LATimes http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-immigration-central-americans-20180207-story.html

And in the article quoted has 11420 illegal migrants coming into Canada from January 1st to july 15th, a little under 1900 illegal Migrants a month.

you also seem to like to jump to conclusions. the data available to me does not lead me to the same conclusion you have reached. that conclusion may be true, but not based solely on the limited information you have presented.

Canadians becoming concerned with unauthorized border crossings is not at all the same as the 'deerrrrp build the wall' attitude down south (yes, I recognize not everyone supports the wall. but enough do).

Even before Trump and his wall nonsense, there was a vocal group of Americans who were very concerned about the amount of illegal migrants, and Canadians, IMHO, just lumped them into the group who were scared of foreigners. We may not be manifesting that into some build a wall movement, but the same sentiment that a lot of Canadians simply attributed to Americans being closed minded and anti immigration is alive and well here

also, it is only the second most important issue among those who want a change in government. you are letting the numbers tell you what you want them to.

True, but looking at the other numbers

67 percent of canadians think this is a crisis.

65 percent of canadians feel like Canada cannot handle this, and this is the feeling across the board for all political parties, so i don't think we can simply say this is a issue among those who want a change in government.

 

[UWHabs]

I grabbed the US numbers from the LATimes http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-immigration-central-americans-20180207-story.html

And in the article quoted has 11420 illegal migrants coming into Canada from January 1st to july 15th, a little under 1900 illegal Migrants a month.Even before Trump and his wall nonsense, there was a vocal group of Americans who were very concerned about the amount of illegal migrants, and Canadians, IMHO, just lumped them into the group who were scared of foreigners. We may not be manifesting that into some build a wall movement, but the same sentiment that a lot of Canadians simply attributed to Americans being closed minded and anti immigration is alive and well hereTrue, but looking at the other numbers

67 percent of canadians think this is a crisis.

65 percent of canadians feel like Canada cannot handle this, and this is the feeling across the board for all political parties, so i don't think we can simply say this is a issue among those who want a change in government.

The big difference I think is that in the US, it's a crisis because they want to stop illegal migrants entirely. Whereas in Canada, it's a crisis in that we want to be able to bring in these people, however we just don't have the support and spaces and processing power to handle them. That's obviously not going to be the same reason hardline Conservatives will mention, but I would gather that if you had a sub-survey of the Liberal/NDP issues, that would be the #1 reason they have problems with it.

In any event, it's certainly an issue that's not going away, and something the Libs will have to figure out how to handle. Can they (legally) put in a policy to slow down the influx, and can get find a way to speed up the resolution of refugee claims to either settle or deport people quicker?

 

[Altair]

The big difference I think is that in the US, it's a crisis because they want to stop illegal migrants entirely. Whereas in Canada, it's a crisis in that we want to be able to bring in these people, however we just don't have the support and spaces and processing power to handle them. That's obviously not going to be the same reason hardline Conservatives will mention, but I would gather that if you had a sub-survey of the Liberal/NDP issues, that would be the #1 reason they have problems with it.

In any event, it's certainly an issue that's not going away, and something the Libs will have to figure out how to handle. Can they (legally) put in a policy to slow down the influx, and can get find a way to speed up the resolution of refugee claims to either settle or deport people quicker?

Can they legally slow down the influx? No. To add to this, they have the issue of the anchor families.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/asylum-seekers-border-anchor-relatives-1.4771045

Canadian border officers are reporting on what they call a "phenomenon" on the migrant front: irregular border crossers acting as "anchor relatives" for those making refugee claims at official points of entry.

The Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) says people who have entered the country through irregular migration can make use of an exception in the law facilitate the entry of family members — even when their own claims haven't been adjudicated.

"Recently, CBSA officers are noticing another phenomenon: claimants who have recently arrived in Canada as irregular migrants and have refugee claims in process are acting as an anchor relative for other qualifying family members," says an information package provided to the Parliamentary Budget Officer (PBO) by the CBSA.

"This means that these family members can present themselves at a port of entry and not be considered as irregular migrants. Also, they can't be refused entry under the Safe Third Country Agreement (STCA)."

Can they try to speed up the refugee claims? No idea.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/refugee-board-wait-time-1.4751200

In the 2018 federal budget, the federal government earmarked an additional $74 million over two years, part of which is being used to hire about 250 more staff.

Once all those people are trained, the IRB said it should be able to finalize 17,000 more claims over the next two years — in addition to the 24,000 cases it already processes annually. As a result, they're hoping the average wait time for a hearing drops to 12 months.

 

[Altair]

Anyone have a handle on why canada is taking a diplomatic shit kicking from Saudi Arabia?

Honestly just over a tweet?