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No Excuses No Limits! The mother fucking goddamn season thread

Wayward DP said:
generally agree but pretty certain Marchy's goal was high glove, not blocker. but Sammy was swimming cause he lost his goal stick.

agreed on the DeBrusk one.
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Yeah, you're right. Just watched a better res replay.

I move to strike that from the record your honor...
 
MindzEye said:
Honestly, the Debrusk goal that made it 2-1 was worse. Marchand steps off the boards and fires a harmless wrister. Hits Sammy in the glove and it pops out right in the crease and DeBrusk buries the rebound.

It was a complete disaster class of a game and yeah, probably the turning point of the series.

But. Organizationally, we earned it. Coming into this season with Sammy-Woll as our tandem was asking for this. Bad goaltending was baked into our team DNA for the year.
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Nothing wrong with coming into the season with Sammy-Woll. They got us past the first round last year, which sadly was our high water mark of the past decade.

The problem was shoe horning Sammy into the net when he didn't deserve it. The problem was Woll getting injured for a long time. The problem was Sammy coming back from injury and going on a bit of a heater. The problem was zero improvements at the deadline. For some reason, they thought getting 17 more bad dmen was the most addressable need, and not the fact that we had no proven starter.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
Nothing wrong with coming into the season with Sammy-Woll.
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There's tons wrong with it. Sammy was a below average goalie over his career who had one good season for us last year. Him falling apart eventually was his MO. This was are predictable as Jack falling apart eventually. Sometimes you fluke out and get a real mid-late career breakout, especially out of goalies, so he was worth the risk but it was a risky play, regardless. If you're taking the risk on him, your #2 can't be a 25 yr old with 11 career NHL games and only 1 season (21 AHL games really) in his professional or college career with any level of real success.

Our goaltending being bad this season was entirely predictable, and required a minor miracle to be anything but.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
I mean, that's why you come back with him.
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Or....you be thankful that a bad goalie was good for a year, and you move on from him.

But fine. If you insist on running back the bad goalie who was good for a year (which I get the logic behind, none of this is exact science, cool). Then you need to have a functioning plan B that isn't a nothing prospect with a single 6-8 week AHL heater on his resume, and a 34 yr old that had already played his way out of the league.

Btw, how's Kallgren doing these days?
 
This team is good enough to win with any goalie, but unfortunately not good enough to overcome the obstacles posed by Trefucker and Fatfucker.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
This team is good enough to win with any goalie, but unfortunately not good enough to overcome the obstacles posed by Trefucker and Fatfucker.
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Do fuck right off with this.

Somehow the team is good enough to win with any god damn goalie, but both the coach and GM are nightmares....
 
100%.

When Kampf and Reaves are your shutdown guys and play in the final minutes of games you're losing, and when Baboon and Ed are your big deadline pickups to push guys like Lilly out of the lineup, along with a boatload of other bad decisions like what they did to Robertson, only playing McMann by force, leaving Sammy in there to rot while Woll is standing by. It's gonna be almost impossible to win, and we all knew this long before this shitty series started.
 
MindzEye said:
Or....you be thankful that a bad goalie was good for a year, and you move on from him.

But fine. If you insist on running back the bad goalie who was good for a year (which I get the logic behind, none of this is exact science, cool). Then you need to have a functioning plan B that isn't a nothing prospect with a single 6-8 week AHL heater on his resume, and a 34 yr old that had already played his way out of the league.

Btw, how's Kallgren doing these days?
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.872 SV% in the AHL this year.

That’s good, right?
 
LOF is close. Spending a lot of assets on a goalie is not it for me because... Well look at the top tier goalies in this playoff. All at the bottom of the barrel. Happens more often than I'd feel comfortable with. There are no goalies that are locks to have a very good year.. I would have thought Sorokin was that but nah not even him this year.

Goaltending is crucial. No team can win with kallgren or even samsonov..However the amount of variance in goalies season to season and game to game makes it very difficult to know who the "guy" is. That's the challenge. I understand the idea of not going nuts and hoping you get an Adin Hill or Binnington playoff run on a cheap unknown goalie because that's the golden ticket. And that's currently the cap structure of the Leafs. They're gonna need d too. I'd rather spend on d that I know are gonna be dependable than a goalie that you never know what you're gonna get in a given season or playoff.
 
Preston said:
LOF is close. Spending a lot of assets on a goalie is not it for me because... Well look at the top tier goalies in this playoff. All at the bottom of the barrel. Happens more often than I'd feel comfortable with. There are no goalies that are locks to have a very good year.. I would have thought Sorokin was that but nah not even him this year.
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Eh, this isn't really a good argument against settling for risky as fuck/bad goaltending imo. Yes, in small sample even top tier goalies can look bad. But let's zoom out a bit.

Sorokin

1714509514901.png
Helle

1714509548672.png

Both have been somewhere between pretty okay and quite good in the playoffs when we start to see a larger sample within the small seasonal samples.

I mean, if you look at the goalies having the most fun so far after 4 games is Shesty, Varlamov, Swayman, Logan Thompson, and Freddy. All goalies with varying levels of track records at or above league average. The bad goalies have all been bad (Sammy, Lindgren, Georgiev) though. Which is instructive imo. We can look at runs like Hill or Binnington's if we want to, but they're kind of not the same. Hill had been a league average or better goalie for most of the 3-4 years prior to the run, but kept getting stuck in backup jobs behind prime Kuemper, veteran Reimer and Logan Thompson. He was a pretty reliable ~.915 guy across the NHL and AHL over a bunch of years. Binngton's run is a bit overstated imo. .914 sv% isn't exactly a Tim Thomas redux.

Overall, I think the asset spend is kind of immaterial. You need goaltending. Whether that's a combo undervalued scraps from other orgs like Hill in conjunction with an internally developed guy like Thompson, or you're forced into spending big money and 1sts like Florida did with Bob and Knight, it doesn't matter. It's just not fucking negotiable. You need good goaltending, but it's not a guarantee either. Assholes, but necessary assholes.
 
hockeylover said:
i'm cool with that but if we're going with a "let's not spend a lot of assets on a goalie and just play whoever's hot", the key part is probably actually playing whoever's hot and not... sticking with the guy you waived earlier in the season no matter what.
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Exactly. It always comes back to roster management and usage. And we know where the buck stops with that stuff.
 
Eh, sometimes it doesn't matter how you lay the whip. You can't get a nag to win the kentucky derby.

Samsonov and Woll aren't the horses to do the job, full stop.
 
Why do we know that for sure with Woll?

Seems completely premature and unfair to write him off, when he's actually been very good in his limited playoff glimpses.

My whole complaint is that fatty didn't give us a chance to really see what Woll's got, unless he wins three in a row from here and things go berserk. If he loses, we go into the offseason with "no goaltending" despite not ever giving one of them a fair shake.

And how do we call his first start coming while down 3-1 a fair shake?
 
MindzEye said:
Eh, sometimes it doesn't matter how you lay the whip. You can't get a nag to win the kentucky derby.

Samsonov and Woll aren't the horses to do the job, full stop.
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Yeah that's probably fair. Not sure I'd trust Shelly to pick the right goalie if we had a 1a/b situation regardless though.
 
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