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No Excuses No Limits! The mother fucking goddamn season thread

Lorentz-Kampf-Reaves line would challenge for lowest-scoring line in the league. I'd probably take the odds that Reaves would outscore his linemates.
 
Muzzin year 1 (from Feb 1 trade to end of season):

1. Rielly 33gms, EV 38.4toi% (-3.1dzs%), 51.8xgf%, 0.84p1/60, 1.21p/60
2. Muzzin 30gms, EV 35.7toi% (+2.4dzs%), 53.4xgf%, 0.67p1/60, 1.22p/60
3. Hainsey 32gms, EV 34.9toi% (+0.7dzs%), 51.3xgf%, 0.21p1/60, 0.64p/60
4. Zaitsev 32gms, EV 33.7toi% (+4.0dzs%), 49.6xgf%, 0.33p1/60, 0.88p/60

Playoffs

1. Rielly 7gms, 41.7toi% (-0.4dzs%), 57.1xgf% (+7.0rel), 1.22p1/60, 1.63p/60
2. Muzzin 7gms, 35.6toi% (+4.3dzs%), 45.0xgf% (-6.7rel), 0.95p1/60, 0.95p/60
3. Hainsey 7gms, 34.2toi% (+6.1dzs%), 57.2xgf% (+6.0rel), 0.00p1/60, 0.49p/60
4. Zaitsev 7gms, 31.4toi% (+3.8dzs%), 54.4xgf% (+2.7rel), 0.00p1/60, 0.00p/60


Muzzin year 2

1. Rielly 47gms, EV 38.1toi% (-3.0dzs%), 51.4xgf% (-0.2rel), 0.66p1/60, 1.20p/60
2. Barrie 70gms, EV 36.9toi% (-5.4dzs%), 50.4xgf% (-1.4rel), 0.68p1/60, 1.15p/60
3. Muzzin 53gms, EV 36.6toi% (+4.0dzs%), 52.4xgf% (+0.7rel), 0.74p1/60, 1.28p/60
4. Holl 68gms, EV 32.1toi% (+4.7dzs%), 53.6xgf% (+1.5rel), 0.38p1/60, 0.92p/60

Muzz missed the playoffs with injury.


Muzzin year 3

1. Rielly 55gms, EV 39.2toi% (-3.4dzs%), 55.1xgf% (-0.6rel), 0.55p1/60, 1.17p/60
2. Brodie 56gms, EV 37.5toi% (-1.7dzs%), 56.0xgf% (+0.1rel), 0.23p1/60, 0.63p/60
3. Muzzin 53gms, EV 35.6toi% (+2.2dzs%), 56.7xgf% (+0.9rel), 0.70p1/60, 1.39p/60
4. Holl 55gms, EV 35.7toi% (+0.0dzs%), 54.2xgf% (-1.8rel), 0.55p1/60, 1.04p/60

Playoffs

1. Rielly 7gms, 43.0toi% (-9.2dzs%), 71.6xgf% (+9.1rel), 0.40p1/60, 0.80p/60
2. Brodie 7gms, 39.6toi% (-4.8dzs%), 67.9xgf% (+7.1rel), 0.44p1/60, 0.87p/60
3. Muzzin 6gms, 31.2toi% (+3.3dzs%), 44.6xgf% (-7.9rel), 1.31p1/60, 1.96p/60
4. Holl 7gms, 36.8toi% (-3.6dzs%), 44.0xgf% (-6.7rel), 0.47p1/60, 0.47p/60


Muzzin year 4

1. Rielly 82gms, EV 36.8toi% (-0.6dzs%), 53.0xgf% (-3.4rel), 1.10p1/60, 1.57p/60
2. Brodie 82gms, EV 36.7toi% (-0.1dzs%), 55.1xgf% (-0.9rel), 0.55p1/60, 0.95p/60
3. Muzzin 47gms, EV 34.7toi% (+2.4dzs%), 53.2xgf% (-3.0rel), 0.51p1/60, 0.95p/60
4. Holl 69gms, EV 34.2toi% (+3.5dzs%), 55.4xgf% (-0.4rel), 0.40p1/60, 1.00p/60

Playoffs

1. Brodie 7gms, 37.8toi% (+2.3dzs%), 55.8xgf% (+3.9rel),
2. Muzzin 7gms, 37.7toi% (+1.8dzs%), 50.6xgf% (-1.0rel),
3. Rielly 7gms, 36.4toi% (-6.2dzs%), 50.1xgf% (+0.4rel),
4. Boosh 7gms, 28.5toi% (+2.1dzs%), 46.0xgf% (-4.4rel),


Kinda dissappointing to see how poor Muzz was in the playoffs overall, though much of that was due to injury. He still produced offensively in the playoffs though. During the regular season he was pretty great until that last season where he probably shouldn't have been trying to play through the conkies. Interesting thing about Muzz was always how effective he was offensively which drove his numbers probably more than his defense. But injuries were always an issue with Muzz, and not just the conkies.


McCabe year 1 (from March 1 trade on)

1. Brodie 20gms, EV 35.6toi% (+3.0dzs%), 58.0xgf%, 0.17p1/60, 0.68p/60
2. McCabe 21gms, EV 34.4toi% (+0.9dzs%), 54.0xgf%, 0.51p1/60, 0.84p/60
3. Rielly 20gms, 32.3toi% (-4.1dzs%), 46.3xgf%, 0.93p1/60, 1.12p/60
4. Holl 21gms, 30.2toi% (+7.4dzs%), 54.0xgf%, 0.19p1/60, 0.96p/60

Playoffs

1. Rielly 11gms, EV 37.5toi% (-5.1dzs%), 56.7xgf% (+4.1rel), 1.61p1/60, 2.68p/60
2. Brodie 11gms, EV 37.1toi% (+8.9dzs%), 54.9xgf% (+5.3rel), 0.54p1/60, 0.81p/60
3. McCabe 11gms, EV 35.6toi% (+7.1dzs%), 47.3xgf% (-3.5rel), 0.28p1/60, 0.56p/60
4. Schenn 11gms, EV -30.6toi% (-2.7dzs%), 59.5xgf% (+7.7rel), 0.33p1/60, 0.33p/60

McCabe year 2

1. Rielly 72gms, EV 39.1toi% (-3.3dzs%), 51.1xgf% (-1.6rel), 1.01p1/60, 1.52p/60
2. Brodie 78gms, EV 36.7toi% (+0.6dzs%), 51.0xgf% (-1.6rel), 0.41p1/60, 0.95p/60
3. McCabe 73gms, EV 35.2toi% (+3.9dzs%), 52.9xgf% (+0.5rel), 0.65p1/60, 1.07p/60
4. Benoit 64gms, EV 30.4toi% (+5.9dzs%), 51.9xgf% (-1.0rel), 0.06p1/60, 0.24p/60

Playoffs

1. Rielly 7gms, EV 39.0toi% (-6.5dzs%), 54.6xgf% (+7.3rel), 0.44p1/60, 1.33p/60
2. McCabe 7gms EV 34.8toi% (+8.2dzs%), 52.4xgf% (+5.4rel), 0.50p1/60, 0.50p/60
3. Benoit 7gms, EV 31.6toi% (+14.8dzs%), 41.9xgf% (-5.1rel), 0.00p1/60, 0.00p/60
4. Edmundson 7gms, EV 32.2toi% (-1.2dzs%), 45.3xgf% (+0.3rel), 0.00p1/60, 0.54p/60

McCabe's been really good for us other than that first playoffs (also his first ever playoffs). He's not quite as effective offensively as Muzz, but he's no slouch there. His numbers seem to be driven more by defense though. Injuries were a big issue for him early in his career but not so much the last few years.

For me both are at a very similar level at the same age - both guys I would classify as very good tough-usage two-way #2/3 dmen.

Other notes:

- gdamn Mo is a playoffs beast
- wtf happened to Brodie last year. fell right off a cliff. bizarre.
 
zeke said:

View: https://x.com/dalter/status/1841863614430355625
Click to expand...


Lines get much murkier if both Domi and Willy are on the wing.

The one good thing is that it would make it almost impossible for both Lorentz and Reaves to play. Even one of them playing would force somebody like Robertson out of the lineup which seems unlikely based on camp so far.


Knies --- Matthews --- Marner
Domi --- Tavares --- Nylander
Pacioretty --- Holmberg --- Robertson
McMann --- Kampf --- Jarnkrok
(Lorentz --- Dewar --- Reaves)
​
I guess there's one other option - Krok at 3C. Wouldn't be the worst idea but we haven't seen it yet. Then again, based on tonight's preseason roster, Krok might actually be playing C.
 
Pacioretty - Jarnkrok - Robertson
McMann - Kampf - Lorentz
(Dewar - Holmberg - Reaves)
​
I guess could happen.

But if none of Domi, Nylander, Krok are at C, then a guy like Holmberg has to be in the lineup.
 
zeke said:
Lines get much murkier if both Domi and Willy are on the wing.

The one good thing is that it would make it almost impossible for both Lorentz and Reaves to play. Even one of them playing would force somebody like Robertson out of the lineup which seems unlikely based on camp so far.


Knies --- Matthews --- Marner
Domi --- Tavares --- Nylander
Pacioretty --- Holmberg --- Robertson
McMann --- Kampf --- Jarnkrok
(Lorentz --- Dewar --- Reaves)
​
I guess there's one other option - Krok at 3C. Wouldn't be the worst idea but we haven't seen it yet. Then again, based on tonight's preseason roster, Krok might actually be playing C.
Click to expand...
Like that a lot better.

Lorentz Kampf Reaves would be pretty shit.
 
The other option is that they're trading Kampf, Jarnkrok, Liljegren, Reaves, and Minten for Boone Jenner.
 
In fairness with the playing groups vs practice groups these probably aren't indicative of the lines. Berube has been trying to build a 3rd line around JT all camp and I'd bet on that. There is no way he is banking on a Holmberg "identity" line.

I do worry about Lorentz and Reaves making the team though and whose spots it costs.
 
I'll worry about Reaves until he's finally cut, but tbh......Berube has never really carried an outright goon before.

Lorentz types yeah, but not really any Reaves types.


Year 1 PHI:

there was 1 goon on the roster, but he barely played.

J.Rosehill (28) 34gms, 4:57 --- Playoffs: 0gms

He did use 23yr old Rinaldo as a full time 4th liner....but I dunno that i would call Rinaldo a goon. More like a Lorentz type.


Year 2 PHI:

no goons at all.

Rinaldo was still there, but wasn't always in the lineup. The other 4th liners were guys like Bellemare and VanDevelde and Ryan White, unskilled defensive checkers but not goon types at all.


Year 1 STL:

Only goon-ish guys were barely on the roster: Jordan Nolan played 14gms, Chris Thorburn played 1gm.


Year 2 STL:

Only goon-ish guys were barely on the roster: Brouwer played 13gms. Klim Kostin played 4gms....but he was a young guy they thought had some skill I think.


Year 3 STL:

This is the most played Goon in Berube's coaching career:

Clifford: 50gms, 9:56 --- Playoffs: 4gms, 7:57


Year 4 STL:

Clifford only played 2gms this season.

Berube did trio to integrate a trio of young giants into the lineup this season - Kostin 40gms, L.Brown 39gms, Toropchenko 28gms. But only Toropchenko made the playoffs roster, and in general i think he thought these three had some skill and upside, not just goon types. Kostin was traded in the offseason.


Year 5 STL:

Toropchenko became a full time guy at age 23 this year. L.Brown only got 30gms. Again though I don't think either of these guys is a goon type despite their size.



So really the only actual goons Berube has ever employed were Jay Rosehill who he inherited in his first year as coach and quickly dropped from the lineup after barely playing him, and Kyle Clifford, who he used regularly but still as an extra forward not actually a starting forward.... and who had real wheels back then.


I don't think Berube's much interested in playing a goon full time. He likes his 4th line fast.
 
zeke said:
Muzzin year 1 (from Feb 1 trade to end of season):

1. Rielly 33gms, EV 38.4toi% (-3.1dzs%), 51.8xgf%, 0.84p1/60, 1.21p/60
2. Muzzin 30gms, EV 35.7toi% (+2.4dzs%), 53.4xgf%, 0.67p1/60, 1.22p/60
3. Hainsey 32gms, EV 34.9toi% (+0.7dzs%), 51.3xgf%, 0.21p1/60, 0.64p/60
4. Zaitsev 32gms, EV 33.7toi% (+4.0dzs%), 49.6xgf%, 0.33p1/60, 0.88p/60

Playoffs

1. Rielly 7gms, 41.7toi% (-0.4dzs%), 57.1xgf% (+7.0rel), 1.22p1/60, 1.63p/60
2. Muzzin 7gms, 35.6toi% (+4.3dzs%), 45.0xgf% (-6.7rel), 0.95p1/60, 0.95p/60
3. Hainsey 7gms, 34.2toi% (+6.1dzs%), 57.2xgf% (+6.0rel), 0.00p1/60, 0.49p/60
4. Zaitsev 7gms, 31.4toi% (+3.8dzs%), 54.4xgf% (+2.7rel), 0.00p1/60, 0.00p/60


Muzzin year 2

1. Rielly 47gms, EV 38.1toi% (-3.0dzs%), 51.4xgf% (-0.2rel), 0.66p1/60, 1.20p/60
2. Barrie 70gms, EV 36.9toi% (-5.4dzs%), 50.4xgf% (-1.4rel), 0.68p1/60, 1.15p/60
3. Muzzin 53gms, EV 36.6toi% (+4.0dzs%), 52.4xgf% (+0.7rel), 0.74p1/60, 1.28p/60
4. Holl 68gms, EV 32.1toi% (+4.7dzs%), 53.6xgf% (+1.5rel), 0.38p1/60, 0.92p/60

Muzz missed the playoffs with injury.


Muzzin year 3

1. Rielly 55gms, EV 39.2toi% (-3.4dzs%), 55.1xgf% (-0.6rel), 0.55p1/60, 1.17p/60
2. Brodie 56gms, EV 37.5toi% (-1.7dzs%), 56.0xgf% (+0.1rel), 0.23p1/60, 0.63p/60
3. Muzzin 53gms, EV 35.6toi% (+2.2dzs%), 56.7xgf% (+0.9rel), 0.70p1/60, 1.39p/60
4. Holl 55gms, EV 35.7toi% (+0.0dzs%), 54.2xgf% (-1.8rel), 0.55p1/60, 1.04p/60

Playoffs

1. Rielly 7gms, 43.0toi% (-9.2dzs%), 71.6xgf% (+9.1rel), 0.40p1/60, 0.80p/60
2. Brodie 7gms, 39.6toi% (-4.8dzs%), 67.9xgf% (+7.1rel), 0.44p1/60, 0.87p/60
3. Muzzin 6gms, 31.2toi% (+3.3dzs%), 44.6xgf% (-7.9rel), 1.31p1/60, 1.96p/60
4. Holl 7gms, 36.8toi% (-3.6dzs%), 44.0xgf% (-6.7rel), 0.47p1/60, 0.47p/60


Muzzin year 4

1. Rielly 82gms, EV 36.8toi% (-0.6dzs%), 53.0xgf% (-3.4rel), 1.10p1/60, 1.57p/60
2. Brodie 82gms, EV 36.7toi% (-0.1dzs%), 55.1xgf% (-0.9rel), 0.55p1/60, 0.95p/60
3. Muzzin 47gms, EV 34.7toi% (+2.4dzs%), 53.2xgf% (-3.0rel), 0.51p1/60, 0.95p/60
4. Holl 69gms, EV 34.2toi% (+3.5dzs%), 55.4xgf% (-0.4rel), 0.40p1/60, 1.00p/60

Playoffs

1. Brodie 7gms, 37.8toi% (+2.3dzs%), 55.8xgf% (+3.9rel),
2. Muzzin 7gms, 37.7toi% (+1.8dzs%), 50.6xgf% (-1.0rel),
3. Rielly 7gms, 36.4toi% (-6.2dzs%), 50.1xgf% (+0.4rel),
4. Boosh 7gms, 28.5toi% (+2.1dzs%), 46.0xgf% (-4.4rel),


Kinda dissappointing to see how poor Muzz was in the playoffs overall, though much of that was due to injury. He still produced offensively in the playoffs though. During the regular season he was pretty great until that last season where he probably shouldn't have been trying to play through the conkies. Interesting thing about Muzz was always how effective he was offensively which drove his numbers probably more than his defense. But injuries were always an issue with Muzz, and not just the conkies.


McCabe year 1 (from March 1 trade on)

1. Brodie 20gms, EV 35.6toi% (+3.0dzs%), 58.0xgf%, 0.17p1/60, 0.68p/60
2. McCabe 21gms, EV 34.4toi% (+0.9dzs%), 54.0xgf%, 0.51p1/60, 0.84p/60
3. Rielly 20gms, 32.3toi% (-4.1dzs%), 46.3xgf%, 0.93p1/60, 1.12p/60
4. Holl 21gms, 30.2toi% (+7.4dzs%), 54.0xgf%, 0.19p1/60, 0.96p/60

Playoffs

1. Rielly 11gms, EV 37.5toi% (-5.1dzs%), 56.7xgf% (+4.1rel), 1.61p1/60, 2.68p/60
2. Brodie 11gms, EV 37.1toi% (+8.9dzs%), 54.9xgf% (+5.3rel), 0.54p1/60, 0.81p/60
3. McCabe 11gms, EV 35.6toi% (+7.1dzs%), 47.3xgf% (-3.5rel), 0.28p1/60, 0.56p/60
4. Schenn 11gms, EV -30.6toi% (-2.7dzs%), 59.5xgf% (+7.7rel), 0.33p1/60, 0.33p/60

McCabe year 2

1. Rielly 72gms, EV 39.1toi% (-3.3dzs%), 51.1xgf% (-1.6rel), 1.01p1/60, 1.52p/60
2. Brodie 78gms, EV 36.7toi% (+0.6dzs%), 51.0xgf% (-1.6rel), 0.41p1/60, 0.95p/60
3. McCabe 73gms, EV 35.2toi% (+3.9dzs%), 52.9xgf% (+0.5rel), 0.65p1/60, 1.07p/60
4. Benoit 64gms, EV 30.4toi% (+5.9dzs%), 51.9xgf% (-1.0rel), 0.06p1/60, 0.24p/60

Playoffs

1. Rielly 7gms, EV 39.0toi% (-6.5dzs%), 54.6xgf% (+7.3rel), 0.44p1/60, 1.33p/60
2. McCabe 7gms EV 34.8toi% (+8.2dzs%), 52.4xgf% (+5.4rel), 0.50p1/60, 0.50p/60
3. Benoit 7gms, EV 31.6toi% (+14.8dzs%), 41.9xgf% (-5.1rel), 0.00p1/60, 0.00p/60
4. Edmundson 7gms, EV 32.2toi% (-1.2dzs%), 45.3xgf% (+0.3rel), 0.00p1/60, 0.54p/60

McCabe's been really good for us other than that first playoffs (also his first ever playoffs). He's not quite as effective offensively as Muzz, but he's no slouch there. His numbers seem to be driven more by defense though. Injuries were a big issue for him early in his career but not so much the last few years.

For me both are at a very similar level at the same age - both guys I would classify as very good tough-usage two-way #2/3 dmen.

Other notes:

- gdamn Mo is a playoffs beast
- wtf happened to Brodie last year. fell right off a cliff. bizarre.
Click to expand...

It's tough to analyze Muzzin in the playoffs without recognizing that Holl was a terrible partner for him on a shutdown line that didn't really bring anything to it. He wasn't great defensively (fine, but not particularly good). He couldn't move the puck, wasn't physical, etc. He was just a guy who was there and fairly passive and safe most of the time. You can get through the regular season with that guy on your pairing, but when you're locked in a cage with Kucherov +2, or the Perfection Line, there's nowhere to hide.
 
trujaysfan said:
Keep Reaves for game 1 vs the habs and have him take out xshdieveismsbrisnbdjwydvoe or whatever his name is on his first shift.
Click to expand...

If we're going to be psychos about it, let's just have some of the boys from Jane and Finch carjack him and shoot him in the leg.

Problem solved, right?
 
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