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The Fantastically Beautiful Joyously Superfun 22-23 Season Celebration Thread

CH1 said:
It’s not about liking or disliking nerdies — it’s about if you want data that can help you understand what may happen next?

Ie… a team that wins 5 in a row with poor underlying numbers won’t fare as well going forward as a team that went 3-2 even though they dominated every single one of those games…. same predictive indicators (even stronger) occur on an individual level where a player might be on a short term scoring spree based largely on luck while another player might be creating a ton of chances without being rewarded

Most fans spend their time in GM mode here — so nerdies are important part of the discussion but I’m pretty sure everyone here takes off their GM cap when the puck drops and simply want to celebrate a win regardless of salary cap allotments and expected goal percentages
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So, you are saying that if you had two teams tied for points and challenging for the last playoff spot…and one went 5-0 and the other 3-2….the latter team’s “dominance” is the only thing that matters?

That sounds like, wait for it, using stats to rationalize failure…
 
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One looks at the data to better understand what happened, if they so desire.

The score doesn’t always provide clarity. And you can flip it as well, if a team is winning but you don’t feel comfortable with the gameplay, the underlying numbers will provide some insight on how the team needs to adjust.
 
thehabhater said:
So, you are saying that if you had two teams tied for points and challenging for the last playoff spot…and one went 5-0 and the other 3-2….the latter team’s “dominance” is the only thing that matters?

That sounds like, wait for it, using stats to rationalize failure…
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I mean this is not at all what he said, which I think you well know
 
If you're opposed to considering additional relevant data prior to forming your opinions that's fine, but you should own it.

That's all advance stats and nerdies are - additional, relevant data points that both help us understand past performance, and help us predict future performance.

Folks don't need to embrace it. I understand why some don't want to. But at least be fucking honest about it.

I can't believe I'm going to do this, but LOF is at least a partial example of this. He admits he has no time for advanced stats and simply trusts his eyes. Now, he refuses to acknowledge that his eyes are not the best assessor of hockey ability in the world, but that is another issue. At least he's honest about his disdain for additional data points (because his eyes are so superior and reliable, but I digress).
 
CH1 said:
One looks at the data to better understand what happened, if they so desire.

The score doesn’t always provide clarity. And you can flip it as well, if a team is winning but you don’t feel comfortable with the gameplay, the underlying numbers will provide some insight on how the team needs to adjust.
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emphasis on the bolded...

many folks do not desire, but won't simply admit that.
 
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Wayward DP said:
I mean this is not at all what he said, which I think you well know
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The only statistic that matters is, and always will be is ...wait for it...wins vs losses.
While microscopic analysis of details may be fun (and a life goal for some), when the cards are truly on the table come playoff time, only the team that gets 4 wins first advances.

That's it.

One team can statistically dominate and lose game 7 in overtime on a fluke goal
 
thehabhater said:
The only statistic that matters is, and always will be is ...wait for it...wins vs losses.
While microscopic analysis of details may be fun (and a life goal for some), when the cards are truly on the table come playoff time, the team that get 4 wins first advances.

That's it.
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It's all fun and games until you realize that the teams with recent cup success ALL value and utilize advanced statistics more than the average team in the NHL. It's no coincidence that the analytics friendly teams tend to win cups.. Or is it?
 
Preston said:
It's all fun and games until you realize that the teams with recent cup success ALL value and utilize advanced statistics more than the average team in the NHL. It's no coincidence that the analytics friendly teams tend to win cups.. Or is it?
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Seeing that only 8 President's Trophy winners have ever gone on to win the Stanley cup in the same year, I would argue with evidence that when you win is far more important to success than microscopic statistical analysis
 
thehabhater said:
Seeing that only 8 President's Trophy winners have ever gone on to win the Stanley cup in the same year, I would argue with evidence that when you win is far more important to success than microscopic statistical analysis
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If you aren't utilizing "advanced" statistics (they're not that advanced btw.. little secret there) then you won't win. No team in recent years has won that has ignored them. Full stop.

As a fan feel free to not care about them it takes away your enjoyment of the game. But ignoring their value is sheer ignorance.
 
To be more accurate, the only stat that matters is Stanley Cups Won.

And if wins are all that matters, why even watch the games?

And why the hell are you on the internet every day talking about how good teams and players are?
 
It's not really complicated. The nerdies just do a much better job describing what i've always seen on the ice than the crap stats and hoary cliches from 'expert analysis' we grew up with ever did.

That's it that's all.
 
zeke said:
To be more accurate, the only stat that matters is Stanley Cups Won.

And if wins are all that matters, why even watch the games?

And why the hell are you on the internet every day talking about how good teams and players are?
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Oh you little hissy fit. Come down off of the ledge...
 
For the most part I think it's been shown repeatedly by evidence that - generally - teams with good nerdies tend to win more *in the long run* so I appreciate that viewpoint on this board vs other forums.

I do think their use seems to be constantly evolving and getting more sophisticated and sometimes the conclusions people draw from the public stats they choose to prioritize can be completely incorrect. There's still a lot of room to be wrong in the interpretation of these even by those who are all in on "nerdies". Ignoring them altogether seems silly though.
 
hockeylover said:
For the most part I think it's been shown repeatedly by evidence that - generally - teams with good nerdies tend to win more *in the long run* so I appreciate that viewpoint on this board vs other forums.

I do think their use seems to be constantly evolving and getting more sophisticated and sometimes the conclusions people draw from the public stats they choose to prioritize can be completely incorrect. There's still a lot of room to be wrong in the interpretation of these even by those who are all in on "nerdies". Ignoring them altogether seems silly though.
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I agree that evolution is handy. Once upon a time there weren't zambonis either...
 
Preston said:
It's all fun and games until you realize that the teams with recent cup success ALL value and utilize advanced statistics more than the average team in the NHL. It's no coincidence that the analytics friendly teams tend to win cups.. Or is it?
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What’s interesting is that the team that has been the most successful over the past 5+ years (Tampa) is all-in on BOTH the analytics and the leaderbeans/culture/character thing.
 
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