The Mother-fucking goddamn Off-season Thread

[Artnes]

How he handled that CJ question is what set this on fire. This could have been clean break for both and this is all an afterthought if he follows up with a cookie cutter response

Seems he caught Dubas with his guard down and he responded emotionally and in a market where they look for any bit of bait to hang on, that was blood in the water

 

[worm]

yeah of all the implausible BS... "wouldn't let Dubie trade a 5th" is near the top, even before you add "for random former 1st rounder who just so happened to blossom into a star following the missed trade"

Montana is putting the work in

 

[thehabhater]

 

[hockeylover]

How he handled that CJ question is what set this on fire. This could have been clean break for both and this is all an afterthought if he follows up with a cookie cutter response

Seems he caught Dubas with his guard down and he responded emotionally and in a market where they look for any bit of bait to hang on, that was blood in the water

A little weird he couldn't give him anything at all re: reassurance on Wednesday face to face.

 

[Red Line]

Anyways, Kyle's press release confirms shanny's story is true. As i expected.

There's still room to criticize shanny here though - i'm not convinced airing all those details publicly was the right move.

The team can kick Shanny to the curb today for all i care since i'm pissed he hired Dubas in the first place but what did he actually air?

All he really gave was the time frame of events about the contract discussion, it's not like he went into detail about what Dubas told him the issues were with his wife.

To me Shanny looked like a guy who felt betrayed by a person who should be grateful/loyal since Dubas owes his career to BS. I think that's why he went into the detail he did including things like he went to KD's office multiple times only to have KD ghost him then send him an e-mail.

 

[worm]

Sunday - face to face meeting, shanny offers contract that he and agent had been discussing for many weeks, kyle seems happy but doesn't say yes, mentions the stress on the family. they continue for a couple hours talking about the team and shanny says theres no need for a presser immediately

Monday - dubas has the presser, says he's not sure he's in

Tuesday - crickets

Wednesday - face to face meeting which left shanny "with more questions than answers", i.e. even worse than the presser.

Thursday - during the day agent sends him much bigger ask than discussed, kyle sends an email at night to say he wants to stay


I definitely don't see anything rash here on shanny's part. I never did.

Where does the much bigger ask come from?

I keep hearing that but I thought it was "different" not necessarily bigger.

 

[Preston]

Where does the much bigger ask come from?

I keep hearing that but I thought it was "different" not necessarily bigger.

Do we think it was smaller?

 

[zeke]

Please dont give them the idea of putting a salary cap on off-ice personnel too.

 

[hockeylover]

Where does the much bigger ask come from?

I keep hearing that but I thought it was "different" not necessarily bigger.

"new financial package" was the wording.

like someone mentioned before we had heard pretty specific numbers of 4m vs 6-7m + full autonomy but unverified.

 

[zeke]

Where does the much bigger ask come from?

I keep hearing that but I thought it was "different" not necessarily bigger.

You're right we don't know. And no need to buy into the rumoured ask either.

 

[hockeylover]

seeing how we're all getting a little lost in the weeds of this story, maybe more inclined to agree that perhaps saying less was more.

because there were mistakes made by dubas and a lack of playoff success and now we're all focused on if mrs dubas was gonna take the kiddos or not.

 

[Red Line]

Where does the much bigger ask come from?

I keep hearing that but I thought it was "different" not necessarily bigger.

Shanny obviously leaked Dubie was looking for 6-7m with full autonomy and since Dubie's pr people Mirtle/CJ didn't deny it so can you can pretty much take it for fact.

 

[JackBurton]

So desperate for hot takes and attention, they now will discuss things that cannot possibly happen due to NHL rules:

 

[worm]

He approached Dubas in March.

Kyle said he was in. He let his agent talk to Shanny until May about terms.

He approached him after the season ended. Kyle said he was in.

He approached him Sunday in his office with a contract. Kyle said needs to talk to his family.

Why the fuck would Shanny not assume Kyle had a pretty good idea if Kyle's wife was OK with returning anyway? It probably seemed like a formality.

Why leave it all until the last minute (last few months)? The trade deadline was the deciding point?

It makes no sense from either side.

Dubas holding out for more money? Trying to be a UFA gm? Did he feel hurt that Shanny never talked contract before the last few months?

Shanny should have been preparing for life without dubas if it was dubas not wanting to talk contract. Was one playoff round enough to keep him?

I find it all pretty weird.

 

[worm]

Anyways, Kyle's press release confirms shanny's story is true. As i expected.

There's still room to criticize shanny here though - i'm not convinced airing all those details publicly was the right move.

While entertaining he should have known it would create a circus with so many details. But maybe thought he needed to get ahead of the story in case dubas spoke first?

 

[leafman101]

So desperate for hot takes and attention, they now will discuss things that cannot possibly happen due to NHL rules:

For the record Mackinnon signed his deal September 20.

 

[worm]

Whats interesting is that shanny may have actually had way more doubts after losing in 5 to florida but probably didnt want to be too rash and reverse a decision he had made at the deadline and which was confirmed by the 1st round win. He may not have even been overly convinced by the first round performance either tbh.

This makes a bunch of sense. Kyle gave him an opening.

 

[zeke]

Why leave it all until the last minute (last few months)? The trade deadline was the deciding point?

It makes no sense from either side.

Dubas holding out for more money? Trying to be a UFA gm? Did he feel hurt that Shanny never talked contract before the last few months?

Shanny should have been preparing for life without dubas if it was dubas not wanting to talk contract. Was one playoff round enough to keep him?

I find it all pretty weird.

What wouldnt have been "last minute" to you?

Who says Shanny hadnt made any preparations for life after dubas?

 

[worm]

The leafs have a ton of AGMs, and a staff member for everything you can think of. I find it hard to believe he was burning the candle at both ends.

Dubas will find out pretty quick signing elsewhere that there can be a lot more to do in that role.

Yes and no
Fewer direct reports can be easier.

 

[MindzEye]

The leafs have a ton of AGMs, and a staff member for everything you can think of. I find it hard to believe he was burning the candle at both ends.

Dubas will find out pretty quick signing elsewhere that there can be a lot more to do in that role.

Yeah, I get the whole bit about Toronto being a massive fishbowl for the top, most visible team execs and how that can wear on a family.

But....

The front office doesn't travel with the team, & has more support staff than any other organization in the league. If you think the job is going to be less "all consuming" in a small market where you're cleaning your own toilets and don't have 8 directors of hockey ops to get your coffee in the morning...well fuck. You're going to be asked to do way more, with way less. In a lot of ways, running the Leafs is hockey executiving (not a word, I know, go fuck yourself) on easy mode.