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The New Division

leafman101 said:
Ryan is closer to JVR than he is Kessel.
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im%20retarded%20checking%20mirror.gif
 
Yea. Ryan is 55-60 point perimeter player now.

Not 30+ goal scoring sniper.

I guess some people see what they want to see.
 
MindzEye said:
Kessel, Pac, Ryan.

Over the last 2 seasons Kessel has been an 85 point winger, Pac has been a 70 point winger, and Ryan has been a 55-60 point winger.
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Pacioretty has never scored more than 65 points. He's only scored 30 or more goals once.

This board trips over itself in stupidity sometimes.
 
Too much value is being placed on last season, which was an aberration, for veteran players. If a player had a poor shortened season, it doesn't mean they are necessarily in decline.
 
corksens said:
Pacioretty has never scored more than 65 points. He's only scored 30 or more goals once.

This board trips over itself in stupidity sometimes.
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Past 3 seasons
Pacioretty: 160gp 62g 128p (82gp 32g 66p)
Ryan: 210gp 76g 158p (82gp 30g 62p)
 
The biggest difference between Ryan/Kessel, despite the huge point difference over the last couple years, is that Kessel drives the offense on his line. Kessel produces at an elite rate regardless of who he plays with whereas Ryan needs to play with great players to produce at a 1st line rate.

Kessel is #1 forward. Ryan is a #3 forward.
 
2 year splits:

Kessel - 130 GP, 57 G, 134 P (82 gp, 36 G, 84 P)
...
...
Max Pac - 123 GP, 48 G, 104 P (82 GP, 32 G, 70 P)
...
...
Ryan - 128 GP, 42 G, 87 p (82 GP, 27 G, 56 P)
JVR - 91 GP, 29 G, 56 P (82GP, 26 G, 51 P)

#notevenclose
 
leafman101 said:
2 year splits:

Kessel - 130 GP, 57 G, 134 P (82 gp, 36 G, 84 P)
...
...
Max Pac - 123 GP, 48 G, 104 P (82 GP, 32 G, 70 P)
...
...
Ryan - 128 GP, 42 G, 87 p (82 GP, 27 G, 56 P)
JVR - 91 GP, 29 G, 56 P (82GP, 26 G, 51 P)

#notevenclose
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So you believe Ryan is a 55 point player now?
 
Bobby Ryan is a very good player. I'd love to have him instead of Clarkson. Not saying anything otherwise. He is just closer to JVR than he is to an elite player like Kessel.

Not that there is anything wrong with that. JVR is a good first line hockey player.
 
It's a pretty simple question.

Do you think Ryan will hit around 55 points next season? Is that the player you think he is.
 
Now you're just re-framing the question though.

People here were reacting to your assertion that Ryan is comparable to Kessel, not whether he's going to produce more than 55 points.

Ryan needs to post a couple back to back PPG seasons before he's comparable to Kessel regardless whether he produces 50, 60, 70 points.

If you just asked if Ryan would produce more than 55 points next year, I don't think you'd find many people who would disagree.
 
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Re-framing debates is what this board does.

If you think Ryan is a 35/35 guy then he's not far off of a 35/45 guy like Kessel.

You guys list the two year splits as if that is the player Ryan is. I think it's inaccurate. There is a shortened season in there for starters, and then of course I believe that one bad season can skew things too heavily.

I'm not saying Ryan is equal to Kessel - I'm just saying that there isn't some massive gulf like this board suggests.
 
Well there is a massive gulf. There is a massive gulf with the top players in the league and everyone else. Thats how they are so dominant.

Max Pac is ACTUALLY a 35/70 guy and he isn't anywhere near as good as Kessel, and I hight doubt you'd hear reasonable Habs fans say otherwise.
 
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