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Around the League 2019-2024 Edition

Columbus has some good young pieces, would be kind of cool to see him go there.

Watch him wind up in the desert instead.
 
axlsalinger said:
Not a huge fan of using one number to compare players, but GSVA is a high-quality stat. And I will say that I do agree with much of your assessment, just not with the idea that Nurse & RNH are the main problem here. Team defense is an issue and obviously goaltending is too. And many of the other guys are sucking or underperforming.

GSVA (2022-23):

Nugent-Hopkins: 2.3

Kerfoot: 1.2
Engvall: 0.8
Jarnkrok: 0.1

As for the D, before looking at the numbers I thought about each guy and wondered if it's fair to say that Nurse and Brodie may be similar quality players, with Nurse better offensively and Brodie better defensively. Kind of funny to then see them equal in GSVA.

I'm not convinced that Sandin is this good, but kudos to him for playing really well lately and I can't argue against him based on these numbers.

Also weird to see Barrie is playing better (although the PP is a huge part here), but his 2.4 is a lot better than the last 3 years (1.8, 0.8, 1.1)

Sandin: 2.6
Giordano: 2.4
Barrie: 2.4
Lilly: 2.3
Rielly: 2.2
Nurse 1.3
Brodie: 1.3
Holl: 1.0
Click to expand...

but then you realize that a guy on pace for nearly 100pts only on pace for 2.3gsva is actually....pretty bad. You can see the defensive component of his GSVA is horrible. and we know his even strength production isn't top notch - so pretty much that entire 2.3gsva value is coming from riding shotgun on the PP with McDrai. He's arguably got the cushiest PP duty in all of hockey. Now maybe he's a special PP player in his own right, but given his even strength production, i doubt it, and I know he wouldn't be on the top unit on our team.

Same thing with Barrie and Nurse - a ton of their value comes from that PP, and they're still not as good as our PP guys. Take that PP value away and they're not accumulating more gsva than Brodie and Holl are.

and remember the GSVA player card values are just for what the model thinks they'll finish at this year based on what they already accumulated, not the level the model thinks they are at now and going forward. the true talent gsva on the depth charts shows the D like this:


Rielly 2.8
Sandin 2.5
Lilly 2.3
Barrie 2.3
Giordano 1.9
Nurse 1.8
Brodie 1.3
Bouchard 1.1
Holl 1.0

Rielly and Barrie would take the biggest hits if you removed PP value, with Sandin, Bouchard, Nurse taking significant but lesser hits.

Basically the only reason to want to add either of the Oilers D to our dcorps would be if you think they would upgrade our PP, which i don't think they would.
 
zeke said:
but then you realize that a guy on pace for nearly 100pts only on pace for 2.3gsva is actually....pretty bad. You can see the defensive component of his GSVA is horrible. and we know his even strength production isn't top notch - so pretty much that entire 2.3gsva value is coming from riding shotgun on the PP with McDrai. He's arguably got the cushiest PP duty in all of hockey. Now maybe he's a special PP player in his own right, but given his even strength production, i doubt it, and I know he wouldn't be on the top unit on our team.

Same thing with Barrie and Nurse - a ton of their value comes from that PP, and they're still not as good as our PP guys. Take that PP value away and they're not accumulating more gsva than Brodie and Holl are.

and remember the GSVA player card values are just for what the model thinks they'll finish at this year based on what they already accumulated, not the level the model thinks they are at now and going forward. the true talent gsva on the depth charts shows the D like this:


Rielly 2.8
Sandin 2.5
Lilly 2.3
Barrie 2.3
Giordano 1.9
Nurse 1.8
Brodie 1.3
Bouchard 1.1
Holl 1.0

Rielly and Barrie would take the biggest hits if you removed PP value, with Sandin, Bouchard, Nurse taking significant but lesser hits.

Basically the only reason to want to add either of the Oilers D to our dcorps would be if you think they would upgrade our PP, which i don't think they would.
Click to expand...
Fair points. But if you look at RNH's defensive GSVA, he's at -7.3 this year, but he was never a tire fire there (6.3, 1.0, -0.7 last 3 years). I think he's always been a good player, so maybe a victim of poor team defensive play plus horrible goaltending from Jack. Though he is probably contributing to that as well.

Ceci grades out surprisingly well defensively here, I think they could get by having Nurse-Ceci and one of Barrie/Bouchard (for the PP) on the team, it's the rest of the D-corps sucks and they have been completely sabotaged by Sad Jack behind them.

Though it is also fair to want more from Nurse considering how much they're paying him. (And I mean having Ceci firmly in the bottom 4)
 
Last edited:
Probably Bettman’s dream scenario.

I wouldn’t hate it as a Leafs fan, but kinda crappy to see a super elite talent buried on a garbage team in a garbage market.
 
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