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OT: American Politics

Wayward DP said:
I just wonder how long it takes before that pendulum swings back towards a different group...

cause once they succeed in deporting all the immigrants, america is gonna be a much darker, poorer, and less productive place. who do they blame then? and how quickly do we reach that point?
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Is the immigration stuff just theater to Trump? One can hope that he merely uses it to get what he wants....to stay out of jail. Somewhere in that brain of his, he does understand that cheap labour is the backbone of a capitalist country.
 
SundinsTooth said:
Is the immigration stuff just theater to Trump? One can hope that he merely uses it to get what he wants....to stay out of jail. Somewhere in that brain of his, he does understand that cheap labour is the backbone of a capitalist country.
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I don't think it's theatre. He's a white supremacist at his core.

He's called immigrants "vermin". He repeatedly talked about how they're "poisoning the blood of the country".

and he thinks immigrants are stealing american jobs.
 
Wayward DP said:
here too. pretty sure a majority of the food we import is from US and Mexico...
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We might be the beneficiary of Mexican food production though if the US does this tariff nonsense. Mexico's excess production has to go somewhere and a lot of their most productive regions are becoming semi annual harvest zones with climate change so they'll probably see increased output in the future
 
MindzEye said:
We might be the beneficiary of Mexican food production though if the US does this tariff nonsense. Mexico's excess production has to go somewhere and a lot of their most productive regions are becoming semi annual harvest zones with climate change so they'll probably see increased output in the future
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yah but most Mexican produce arrives to us... via the US, I would assume.

is Mexico gonna start sending container ships to Vancouver and Halifax, instead of trucking things across land? I mean maybe the economics of it support that, but even still, gotta think our prices rise regardless.
 
Wayward DP said:
I don't think it's theatre. He's a white supremacist at his core.

He's called immigrants "vermin". He repeatedly talked about how they're "poisoning the blood of the country".

and he thinks immigrants are stealing american jobs.
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RIght, "theater". He mimic's others...I don't think he really is a political thinker, but a survivalist, schemer, and grifter.
 
MindzEye said:
This feels brexitish but more severe by an order of magnitude. Brexit was an obvious mistake and has turned into a minor catastrophe for the UK. One that was completely predictable at the time. This is the same, but worse. The true believers will always find another group to outsource their blame onto. Today its the illegal immigrants...probably the legal ones after that. When they run out of brown people to blame, all bets are off.
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This will net a Huge loss of Soft Power of the US as Europe will have to protect itself as they will have to consider the US an Unreliable ally.

Don't worry though China's ready to Swoop in nd take a good chunk of it. also Our debt will start to matter a great deal more.. as other currency will have relatively more value which means we'll have to "pay more to massage our debt. at least if Trump does as he's stated. and I mostly expect he will.
 
Wayward DP said:
yah but most Mexican produce arrives to us... via the US, I would assume.

is Mexico gonna start sending container ships to Vancouver and Halifax, instead of trucking things across land? I mean maybe the economics of it support that, but even still, gotta think our prices rise regardless.
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The bottle neck is mexican transport networks. That won't be an issue by the end of this Sheinbaum term. They have some massive rail and port projects underway that will link their central and south with easy access to deep water ports. Shipping by sea will be fast and cheap shortly.
 
Wayward DP said:
I don't think it's theatre. He's a white supremacist at his core.

He's called immigrants "vermin". He repeatedly talked about how they're "poisoning the blood of the country".

and he thinks immigrants are stealing american jobs.
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they are the ones we don't pay enough that an American wants to do..
 
SundinsTooth said:
RIght, "theater".
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what would it take for you to believe what he says about this? obviously in the campaign it can only be rhetoric, not action, but the rhetoric is as alarming as possible.

they chanted "mass deportations now" at the RNC.

there's also his first term to look back on - they separated children from their families during his first term. the Muslim ban. "shithole" countries.

and guys like Stephen Miller are gonna be highly placed in his administration, and Miller is as anti-immigrant as they come.
 
Again, I did say I was speaking from a place of hope.

The one bright point I suppose to this threat to immigrants, is that he is a blow hard. He also has won the election, so the apparent threat from immigrants will magically vanish. There is one thing I am sure of, and that is the fact that the population reacts to the news cycle in a way that defies belief.
 
Wayward DP said:
what would it take for you to believe what he says about this? obviously in the campaign it can only be rhetoric, not action, but the rhetoric is as alarming as possible.

they chanted "mass deportations now" at the RNC.

there's also his first term to look back on - they separated children from their families during his first term. the Muslim ban. "shithole" countries.

and guys like Stephen Miller are gonna be highly placed in his administration, and Miller is as anti-immigrant as they come.
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Logistics is one reason why they won't realistically be able to pull off insane mass deportations. But for every piece of theatre, they're going to try doing something. It's just a question if they are happy to deport a handful of people, hire, a few hundred new ICE officers, and call it a day, or if they will go to a more extreme level to actually carry it out.
 
I think trump lies equally about things we don't want to hear (i.e. he will make rfk in charge of health and will ban all vaccines) as much as he lies about things we do want to hear (i.e. he will slash energy prices in half). But I get the fear.
 
Tryamw said:
This will net a Huge loss of Soft Power of the US as Europe will have to protect itself as they will have to consider the US an Unreliable ally.

Don't worry though China's ready to Swoop in nd take a good chunk of it. also Our debt will start to matter a great deal more.. as other currency will have relatively more value which means we'll have to "pay more to massage our debt. at least if Trump does as he's stated. and I mostly expect he will.
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The global south is getting pretty wary of China, the truth is really that we're moving back to a geopolitical period more like the 1st half of the 20th than the 2nd half. Smaller regional power arrangements with multiple large centre's of gravity competing with one another on a more level playing field. I think the next generation of Americans are going to be cranky with this generation for giving away home field advantage for nothing of value.

Putins desire for the return of the era of great power politics seems to be winning right now.
 
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