OT: MLB Thread
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WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou
I will get banned again soon, worry not.
One more league where players won't want to play in Montreal.
I was living in Vancouver when the Grizzlies came into being. There were players they couldn't even bother drafting because said players had shoe endorsement deals stipulating that they could not play for certain teams. Their agents would advise these players to refuse to report and they told the Grizzlies ahead of the draft not to bother because their client was never going to come to Vancouver.
Now do Montreal.
lecoqsportif
Well-known member
Build the team core with Euros.
NBA would survive easier in Montreal where they can play from the Bell Center , without dumping a billion building an arena .
League has massive network revenues , I don’t think any team loses money
MLB will never work in Montreal , team will never be competitive
WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou
I will get banned again soon, worry not.
Neither will an NBA team. Not when players have it in their endorsement contracts that they can't even be drafted by Montreal, let alone sign or be traded there. The NBA couldn't even make it in Vancouver, which is a market much more suited to the NBA than Montreal ever will be.
Sal_Butera
Well-known member
Is this your shell game you talk about
WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou
I will get banned again soon, worry not.
Pro sports is just a real estate scam nowadays. The real estate (stadium plus condos, all or mostly paid for with taxpayer money) is the real game. The team is just a lever.
anyone ever tell you that you are very cynical?
WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou
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Prove me wrong. Why do teams like the Braves and the Rangers need new stadiums barely 20 odd years after they built their old ones? Because the new stadiums also included neighborhood development (condos) that the previous ones didn't. Bronfman's group didn't just buy that area of the Peel Basin where a ballpark would go, they bought a huge swath of land down there. And they submitted two development proposals; one with, and one without a stadium included. But the condos? They're in both proposals because that's where the real money is to be made. Oakland can't gentrify and develop the way Vegas can because, at the end of the day, it's still going to be Oakland. And as anyone who's been there can tell you, Oakland is not and never will be San Francisco. It is less affluent, less white and therefore less desirable than Vegas. The team goes to whatever market is willing to pay for it and can generate the most revenue.
Sal_Butera
Well-known member
No need to look that far - Habs ownership consortium makes more profit from their high rise condo project now entering what building #5 (?) than any other business.
Also used for tax losses on other entities
Sal_Butera
Well-known member
Montreal will NOT be the new home for the Rays, the plan was never for them to be a full time team.
WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou
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The part time plan was never an actual plan. It was a ploy to pit Montreal against Tampa in hopes that the presence of one would scare the other into committing tax dollars to a stadium deal. When neither city blinked, the plan, such as it was, was dead because MLB was never going to sign off on a split city arrangement. It was always a scam.
WeHaveMoreCupsThanYou
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There is nothing clear about that.
We need to stop looking at the viability of expansion cities from the standpoint of fan bases, metropolitan populations and a whole lot of stuff that might matter on the field but doesn't really matter off of it. In the end, it boils down to one thing and one thing only:
MONEY, specifically "free" money, otherwise known as tax money.
The North American pro sports business model in the 21st Century is all about the real estate and about how much of everything a franchise can con a city into paying the costs of that real estate. Nothing else matters as much as that. Nobody in MLB gives a shit that Montreal had a team for 3 and a half decades. They would happily put a franchise in Des Moines Iowa if the money was right and the funding was public.
Montreal (and, so far, Tampa) are where they are because the people who pay taxes in those cities have refused to play the money game. They will not entertain the idea of spending public money on a privately owned stadium. Tampa might one day cave to this but Montrealers never will. Not one fucking dime of public money will ever be approved for a baseball stadium. Jamais! If they wouldn't pay to build an arena for the Habs there's no goddamn way they're ever going to do it for a team not named the Habs. So no, it's not "clear".
What is clear is that unless Bronfman or someone else pays the cost of buying a franchise and building a ballpark on their own (which is contrary to the MLB business model) Montreal is never getting a franchise. And of course no businessman is taking on the costs of a franchise fee and a stadium build because they would never be able to make their money back fast enough or perhaps ever. The model is for profits to be private while costs, debts and all the risks are held by the public. It's a lousy trade-off for any city but as long as there are cities in the US willing to cut funding to hospitals and schools in order to build vanity project stadiums for billionaire owners, there will be no incentive for any pro sports league to revisit the business model. Currently, that model is working like a mo-fo for the owners.
Sal_Butera
Well-known member
Not sure if anyone has watched the Reggie Jackson documentary on Amazon Prime - talks about “Expos kings ransom offer” he turned down to sign for significantly less w NYY in Nov, 1976.
Bronfman’s offer was in excess of $3.5M over 5-years, whereas, NYY offer was less than $3M. Recall, pre-1982 there was no US / Canada tax treaty - American ball players paid minimal IRS taxes w first $150K tax free, and had a min flat rate in Canada, which is why so many had homes and lived in Mtl area - Carter, Speir, Grimsley, Parrish etc
Different times…
Bronfman’s offer was in excess of $3.5M over 5-years, whereas, NYY offer was less than $3M. Recall, pre-1982 there was no US / Canada tax treaty - American ball players paid minimal IRS taxes w first $150K tax free, and had a min flat rate in Canada, which is why so many had homes and lived in Mtl area - Carter, Speir, Grimsley, Parrish etc
Different times…
I like the Reggie documentary. I was tempted to by a Reggie Oakland A's jersey at Lids after seeing it.