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OT: The News Thread

uncus said:
This must be a joke ......
If people really are so concerned with the safety of others, how about govenors in automobiles? After all, in most instances, an automobile is used in the act of an offence using a firearm.
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In an urban environment, automobiles serve incredible utility. In an urban environment that already outlaws conceal/carry, guns are borderline useless.


Heck, automobiles cause or are involved in 100,000s of thousands of deaths and injuries each year in north america.
Throw a govenor in every single vehicle whether car truck or motorcycle.
Fine the auto manufacturing companies for producing illegal products ..... wtf can you go over 130 in canada.
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WHAT ABOUT ___________ ????!?!?!?!

Odds are, if your argument is a "whataboutism", it's a shit argument.


So, i guess it is obvious that my final comment is ..... from my cold dead hands ......lol
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Note that I said that I wouldn't care if municipalities were allowed to, and proceeded to outlaw all firearms in their jurisdictions. If that were the case, and you wanted to move outside of Toronto to somewhere you could continue owning firearms, knock yourself out. Inside of Toronto, with existing regulations what they are, they're ****ing useless. You're not deer hunting on Bloor.
 
MindzEye said:
In an urban environment, automobiles serve incredible utility. In an urban environment that already outlaws conceal/carry, guns are borderline useless.




WHAT ABOUT ___________ ????!?!?!?!

Odds are, if your argument is a "whataboutism", it's a shit argument.




Note that I said that I wouldn't care if municipalities were allowed to, and proceeded to outlaw all firearms in their jurisdictions. If that were the case, and you wanted to move outside of Toronto to somewhere you could continue owning firearms, knock yourself out. Inside of Toronto, with existing regulations what they are, they're ****ing useless. You're not deer hunting on Bloor.
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And we should ban cars too. Hopefully someday soon we'll have autonomous cars and forbid driving within the city.
 
I hope not. Lot of great movies involving cars will seem ridiculous. Someone better create an amendment to protect car ownership.
 
MindzEye said:
I generally agree, but with one caveat. "Law abiding gun owners" tend to get their guns stolen a lot. For example, in Alberta between 2013 & 2016, just in RCMP jurisdictions (Edmonton and Calgary both have their own police services, representing about half of the population of the province) there were 4500 guns stolen from "law abiding gun owners".

So if many/most illegal guns start out their lives as legally purchased and owned guns, surely ratcheting down on the availability of legal firearms (or at least stiffening storage/transport regulations to make stealing them more difficult) is part of the solution?

I completely agree that the RCMP needs to be doing everything it can to stop illegal guns from coming across the US border, but I don't know if I buy this "our regulations are enough" stuff. Tbh, I'd be entirely cool if municipalities were allowed to set some of their own restrictions. If Toronto wanted to ban legal gun ownership, I don't think I would have a problem with that.
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I respectfully disagree with some of your post.

I don’t think a municipality should be allowed to ban firearms. So a hunter who lives in the city can’t own a firearm? If you let one city. The next thing, the whole country bans them. I realize we don’t have the “right to bear arms” like the second amendment in the US, not that I think that is still an argument. But a lot of people in this country own firearms and use them for hunting, others use them for sport shooting. This can be a very effective method of stress relief and a great play for social networking.

Also I think our checks into obtaining a firearm is enough. Not sure if they are many gun owners or not on here. But you don’t just show up and buy a gun here in canada. Unlike what Trudeau would lead ppl to believe. Now whether or not we need more stringent storage laws well that’s up for debate. As they are currently pretty stiff for restricted weapons already. If people are getting them stole then maybe they should be inspected and could rightfully be charged with unlawful storage of a firearm.

Is there room for improvement? Always. Nothing is every perfect.
 
You’ll just create an even bigger black market for guns. This guy was batshit crazy, I don’t know if the gun he used was stolen or purchased illegally but a guy that hell bent on hurting people quickly (I’m extrapolating from the video available) would have found one on the black market.

Out of curiosity, did anyone hear anything about where he got the gun?
 
Habsy said:
You’ll just create an even bigger black market for guns. This guy was batshit crazy, I don’t know if the gun he used was stolen or purchased illegally but a guy that hell bent on hurting people quickly (I’m extrapolating from the video available) would have found one on the black market.

Out of curiosity, did anyone hear anything about where he got the gun?
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No comment yet on where the gun came from

Your are 100% correct Habsy . When your over the edge no one will stop anyone from hurting people .
 
GEEMAN said:
No comment yet on where the gun came from

Your are 100% correct Habsy . When your over the edge no one will stop anyone from hurting people .
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Agreed.
I have guns, and on occasion, I have had to use then on problem predators.(chickens are a the biggest dinner bell for all wildlife lol).
Also, my point was to show how rediculous the logic of a municipality having the ability to ban fire arms entirely was .... using the same logic on automobiles. You dont need privately owned automobiles in toronto. You have public transit. Transport companies would have the ability to use the roads much the same way cops are allowed to have guns. That would stop many more injuries and the strain on our health services ...... the 400 shooting victims and the 10000 automobile accidents.
 
Seriously, though, banning guns in Toronto wouldn't stop very much. I mean, I don't even know where you even go to buy one. It's not like they sell them at Wal-Mart here. We don't have the same culture as the US.

They do need to look into the spike in incidents this year and figure that out. But the solution is probably more about rooting out gang violence and adding more social support than dealing with guns specifically.
 
GEEMAN said:
No comment yet on where the gun came from

Your are 100% correct Habsy . When your over the edge no one will stop anyone from hurting people .
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I disagree. Harm reduction is an important factor here.

For starters, it's good that all this lunatic was able to get his hands on was one handgun. If this was the United States and it was dead simple for this guy to go out and acquire multiple assault rifles/automatic weapons & piles of ammunition, there would be a hell of a lot more damage than two people dead and about a dozen people injured.

I think it's also worth asking what possible purpose it serves having privately-owned, easily concealable handguns in a major urban center like Toronto. I mean, if you live in the city of Toronto, but heading out of town to go hunting is one of your favourite hobbies, and you have nowhere to store your gun or guns outside of the city, then fine, I can understand that. But who goes out into the bush and hunts wild game with a handgun?
 
uncus said:
This must be a joke ......
If people really are so concerned with the safety of others, how about govenors in automobiles? After all, in most instances, an automobile is used in the act of an offence using a firearm.
Heck, automobiles cause or are involved in 100,000s of thousands of deaths and injuries each year in north america.
Throw a govenor in every single vehicle whether car truck or motorcycle.
Fine the auto manufacturing companies for producing illegal products ..... wtf can you go over 130 in canada.
So, i guess it is obvious that my final comment is ..... from my cold dead hands ......lol
Click to expand...

agreed - regulate cars better
when self driving cars take over you are still going to have people say "from my cold dead hands"
 
LeafGm said:
I disagree. Harm reduction is an important factor here.

For starters, it's good that all this lunatic was able to get his hands on was one handgun. If this was the United States and it was dead simple for this guy to go out and acquire multiple assault rifles/automatic weapons & piles of ammunition, there would be a hell of a lot more damage than two people dead and about a dozen people injured.

I think it's also worth asking what possible purpose it serves having privately-owned, easily concealable handguns in a major urban center like Toronto. I mean, if you live in the city of Toronto, but heading out of town to go hunting is one of your favourite hobbies, and you have nowhere to store your gun or guns outside of the city, then fine, I can understand that. But who goes out into the bush and hunts wild game with a handgun?
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You are not allowed to carry a handgun in the bush for one, unless you are a trapper and apply for a permit to do so. Or if you work in a remote location and your company allows you and you also have to apply for a permit for that as well. They are extremely specific rules on where and how you are allowed to transport and discharge a restricted firearm in canada. This includes handguns and as you called them so called assault weapons. You also are not allowed to own automatic rifles in Canada (unless you have a prohibited license which are impossible to get) or most of the US actually maybe all of the US but I am not 100% up on the US gun laws.

A lot of focus is always on the higher capacity firearms when handguns actually do majority of the killings. most of those are probably gang related in canada and probably the US as well. I think as someone above mentioned that this is where the focus has to be if you want a significant drop in homicide or gun related numbers.
 
And if you transport your handgun anywhere from its place of storage, you have to notify the authorities and a travel plan in ontario canada.
 
Actually I like the idea of no guns at all in toronto.
Really ..... it will leave more moose and deer tags for those of us up here.
Wonder how long before they put a dangerous weapon on a crossbow and compound and recurve bows.
 
People getting their guns stolen is probably not the big one, it's the organized thefts...years ago I remember my wife working with some fingerprint specialists when a Canadian tire was hit, specifically for it's guns and ammo.

I've heard that a lot of stolen guns never make it to the retailer.
 
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