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The Mother-fucking goddamn Off-season Thread

Another thing - some are putting maybe too much focus on the Kyle presser. One of the key takeaways from Shanny was that he was trying to get this extension done since even before the playoffs. Kyle delayed, got an agent involved. Shanny wanted it done after the first round. Kyle didn’t, likely because he was betting on himself to go deep and justify the big increase he ultimately demanded. Even after the loss, there was more delay.

While Shanny was being patient, Kyle was avoiding signing on the dotted line, which must have been annoying for Shanny, but he just went with it. With the presser, then it looked like maybe all the delay was actually because Kyle wasn’t all in, which shook Shanny. And then when the counter came, it all looked like a cheap ruse, with Dubie dicking around the guy who, in his mind, put him in this position, backed him over much older and more experienced guys, was going to pay him handsomely despite no playoff success.

In the end, Shanny probably felt pretty disrespected, and Kyle now feels totally betrayed, and each did their thing in a public presser, so now the animosity is very real.
 
Artnes said:
Isn’t Friedman just rehashing the obvious with Matthews. He was always going to get a feel for the new GM and direction of the team if Dubas was fired before signing any extension . Connecting the dots here
Click to expand...

The Matthews part is funny - a great example of how the media can make nothing sound like something.

Unless i missed something, the only things said about Matthews so far are:

1. A reporter's own speculation that he might not sign immediately now
2. An apparent player quote that said "i don't know" what matthews will do


But when you "report" those things the right way, then suddenly the story becomes "Matthews is upset and has chosen not to re-sign unless the team wins him back over", based on literally nothing.
 
it's obvious once you see how the pieces fit together.

the players think Dubas team construction sucks ... and want to leave now that he's gone.

every executive around the league is interested in the job of Leaf GM ... but there's no way they can work under Shanahan.

and the mastermind of this whole scheme is ... Kyle Dubas, who on a previous road trip found an amazing deal on a house in Pittsburgh.
 
Matthews isn’t going anywhere. It’s so ridiculous how panic sets in with change and unrealistic scenarios suddenly seem plausible because all the talk builds them up into something real.

This is the same as when everyone was scared shitless Nylander wasn’t going to sign and would miss that entire season.

Matthews will be a Leaf for a long time yet. The real risk is in whether the new guy trades Marner or Nylander. But if he wants to keep them both, they’re not going anywhere either.
 
LeafOfFaith said:
Another thing - some are putting maybe too much focus on the Kyle presser. One of the key takeaways from Shanny was that he was trying to get this extension done since even before the playoffs. Kyle delayed, got an agent involved. Shanny wanted it done after the first round. Kyle didn’t, likely because he was betting on himself to go deep and justify the big increase he ultimately demanded. Even after the loss, there was more delay.

While Shanny was being patient, Kyle was avoiding signing on the dotted line, which must have been annoying for Shanny, but he just went with it. With the presser, then it looked like maybe all the delay was actually because Kyle wasn’t all in, which shook Shanny. And then when the counter came, it all looked like a cheap ruse, with Dubie dicking around the guy who, in his mind, put him in this position, backed him over much older and more experienced guys, was going to pay him handsomely despite no playoff success.

In the end, Shanny probably felt pretty disrespected, and Kyle now feels totally betrayed, and each did their thing in a public presser, so now the animosity is very real.
Click to expand...

The other thing is that this likely isn't a rash and unconsidered decision. There has obviously been heavy discussion in the organization about whether or not to re-sign dubas for a long while now, and that would have included good arguments on both sides and lots of consideration of other options and possibilities.

From the sounds of it, Shanny was likely the one leading the pro-dubas arguments, though that doesn't mean he thought it was an easy, clear-cut, slamdunk no brainer....and then Dubas' most recent actions were enough to turn a vigorous argument the other way.
 
axlsalinger said:
it's obvious once you see how the pieces fit together.

the players think Dubas team construction sucks ... and want to leave now that he's gone.

every executive around the league is interested in the job of Leaf GM ... but there's no way they can work under Shanahan.

and the mastermind of this whole scheme is ... Kyle Dubas, who on a previous road trip found an amazing deal on a house in Pittsburgh.
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The same guy who said in his presser that it was TO or nothing.

It’ll be incredibly interesting if he goes back on that now and literally does “show up next week somewhere else.”
 
Dubas had an offer, but went public with his "I don't know if I want to be GM anymore" cry.
At that moment, the tooth became loose. Shanny thought, "we have a problem"

The tooth fell out when Dubas said I want to be GM, but at more money and more power.

And all of this is public knowledge.

Everything else, that you are hearing or reading, are strictly opinions.

This is clear as finding the body with burns and stabbing and bullet wounds and trying to determine if foul play was involved.
 
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zeke said:
The other thing is that this likely isn't a rash and unconsidered decision. There has obviously been heavy discussion in the organization about whether or not to re-sign dubas for a long while now, and that would have included good arguments on both sides and lots of consideration of other options and possibilities.

From the sounds of it, Shanny was likely the one leading the pro-dubas arguments, though that doesn't mean he thought it was an easy, clear-cut, slamdunk no brainer....and then Dubas' most recent actions were enough to turn a vigorous argument the other way.
Click to expand...
Yup, I think Shanny was very deliberate in saying that he was in control of the process, that he was the one who paved the way for Kyle to return. We already know he was the one who chose him over Lou and Hunter in the first place.

If you bust your ass taking risks on a guy, and then sticking with him despite the risk not yet having paid off after several years, and then you don’t get a quick signature and have the guy delay and sort of devalue and diminish everything on live tv against your recommendation…that’s kinda a lot.

The situation really dates back to 9 years ago. I think Shanny felt he and the team deserved more respect than they got, and when that part of the picture sort of crumbles on you, you start to look at things very differently. Like yeah, I like this guy, that’s why I put him in charge, but now that I’m seeing this side that I never saw before, really…what the fuck has he done to deserve it?

If Dubie won the cup this year, I think that accomplishment, that track record would’ve maybe justified a bit of his behavior. But when he got punted again, even if one round later than usual, what justifies the delay and big ask? Be thrilled you’ve got an extension offer and dive in head first.
 
Oh, one last thing Shanahan you fucking meathead, keep fucking with number crunchers. Good strategy.
 
zeke said:
The Matthews part is funny - a great example of how the media can make nothing sound like something.

Unless i missed something, the only things said about Matthews so far are:

1. A reporter's own speculation that he might not sign immediately now
2. An apparent player quote that said "i don't know" what matthews will do


But when you "report" those things the right way, then suddenly the story becomes "Matthews is upset and has chosen not to re-sign unless the team wins him back over", based on literally nothing.
Click to expand...
Tmz toronto strikes again
 
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