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The New Division

SENSible said:
The Sens generated more goals than the Leafs.

They did so by generating FAR more shots and scoring chances.

They had worse goaltending so they lost the series...not too difficult to figure out, for most people.
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Erm, what?

Goals per series

2000: Toronto 17, Ottawa 10
2001: Toronto 10, Ottawa 3 (!)
2002: Ottawa 18, Toronto 16
2004: Toronto 12, Ottawa 11

Total: Toronto 57, Ottawa 40.
 
JohnnyHolmes said:
Leafs fans like to build up Lalime and downplay Cujo / Belfour because the truth hurts. Their team was complete shit, and won games and series' they had no business winning.
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Combined team points in 2000, 2001, 2002, and 2004:

Toronto: 393 (98.25 points/season)
Ottawa: 400 (100 points/season)

The two teams were almost identical points-wise.
 
You don't get extra wins tacked on for a blowout win in game one. Take that result out of the equation and the Leafs outscored Ottawa 16-13 the rest of the way.
 
Hey there is no question that you deserved to win in 2001. That was a pathetic effort from Ottawa, and not coincidentally Yashin's last year.

The Leafs were where they were because their goaltending kept them in games they didn't belong in. Quite similar to last year's Senators team.
 
The Leafs were one of the top scoring teams in the league and had a plethora of Hall of Famers on those clubs. I don't know why you keep downplaying that.
 
A plethora of beyond their best before date Hall of Fame players that achieved pretty much everything they ever did playing for other teams...sure.
 
And yeah the Leafs did receive better goaltending in those series', but they also were a better team playoff-wise than Ottawa. They were constructed much more effectively for the grind and long-haul of the post-season.

That's something Ottawa never learned, and one could argue still has failed to learn: that the marathon of the post-season is significantly different from how a team is constructed in the regular-season.

It still boggles my mind that they continued to send guys out like Pothier, Persson, Ylonen, Arvedson, Dackell, McEachern, and the like year after year without trying to make the necessary adjustments.
 
Funny that the playoff wizard Leafs players folded against their next opponents every time, and that Ottawa had success against those same opponents.

Don't you think?

I guess if you ever want to know how to beat Philly, or NJD since the turn of the millennium, inquire 350 KM east.
 
You can't use the goaltending argument if Ottawa managed to knock off Brodeur twice in his prime, like they did. So which is it?
 
JaysCyYoung said:
And yeah the Leafs did receive better goaltending in those series', but they also were a better team playoff-wise than Ottawa. They were constructed much more effectively for the grind and long-haul of the post-season.

That's something Ottawa never learned, and one could argue still has failed to learn: that the marathon of the post-season is significantly different from how a team is constructed in the regular-season.

It still boggles my mind that they continued to send guys out like Pothier, Persson, Ylonen, Arvedson, Dackell, McEachern, and the like year after year without trying to make the necessary adjustments.
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The Sens were better in every way except goaltending.

The "built for the playoffs Leafs" managed to get bounced the next round after the Sens series every time. Just be glad their goalies were on fire vs Ottawa or you'd have nothing to crow about since 67.
 
SENSible said:
The Sens were better in every way except goaltending.
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If the Sens were better they would have had significantly more points than the Leafs over the same time period. Twice the Leafs were a better regular-season team and twice they scored more goals.

The Leafs had better top-end defenders and significantly better centres.

And yeah they had an advantage in net. It's no surprise that they ended up owning Ottawa.
 
JaysCyYoung said:
You can't use the goaltending argument if Ottawa managed to knock off Brodeur twice in his prime, like they did. So which is it?
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You tell me. Where were your guns against Philly or the Devils, or Carolina.

Carolina.

It's hockey. Shit happens. We couldn't beat you for a variety of reasons, you couldn't beat Philly, and Philly couldn't beat us.
 
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