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Around the League 2019-2024 Edition

Habsy said:
I'm remaining positive on the big Slovak.
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Knock yourself out. But this is 2 years in a row of underwhelming age adjusted production. Looking pretty Puljujarvi-ish at the moment.

17
Jesse - Liiga - .56ppg
Juraj - Liiga - .32ppg

18
Jesse - NHL - .29 ppg, AHL - .72ppg
Juraj - NHL - .28ppg,


Now, I think JP was dicked around by Edmonton and could have turned into a really nice 2 way winger that gives you 20g/50pts and very good play driving. But it was clear pretty early on in his pro career that there was no star there. Similar should be setting in with the Habs now. There's no star in your #1 overall.
 
MindzEye said:
Knock yourself out. But this is 2 years in a row of underwhelming age adjusted production. Looking pretty Puljujarvi-ish at the moment.

17
Jesse - Liiga - .56ppg
Juraj - Liiga - .32ppg

18
Jesse - NHL - .29 ppg, AHL - .72ppg
Juraj - NHL - .28ppg,


Now, I think JP was dicked around by Edmonton and could have turned into a really nice 2 way winger that gives you 20g/50pts and very good play driving. But it was clear pretty early on in his pro career that there was no star there. Similar should be setting in with the Habs now. There's no star in your #1 overall.
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If only everything was one size fits all eh?

I'm currently basing me patience on his character. He has the fortitude. It shows.

I don't think anyone thought he was elite. I know I didn't. I think he can be a very good power forward once he learns to use his frame. To his own admission he wasn't allowed to even do some of the things that are legal in the NHL. Physically.

As I've mentioned, he should have been sent to kitchener after the 9 game pony show. Then he would take a month or so to learn the American game some then you want to see him light it up. Once that happens you move him up to the A. If that repeats he's in the league at 20.

Montreal is just a bad team and I know it's fanbase, MSL and Slafkovsky are trinkets this season. Sorry Marty.
 
I mean he will probably be better than pool party, but that bar is pretty low.

Maybe he's turned it around, but wasn't he pushing 400lbs at training camp? Or is fortitude how many Popeyes tendies you can drive down your gullet?
 
MindzEye said:
Knock yourself out. But this is 2 years in a row of underwhelming age adjusted production. Looking pretty Puljujarvi-ish at the moment.

17
Jesse - Liiga - .56ppg
Juraj - Liiga - .32ppg

18
Jesse - NHL - .29 ppg, AHL - .72ppg
Juraj - NHL - .28ppg,


Now, I think JP was dicked around by Edmonton and could have turned into a really nice 2 way winger that gives you 20g/50pts and very good play driving. But it was clear pretty early on in his pro career that there was no star there. Similar should be setting in with the Habs now. There's no star in your #1 overall.
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When the Finnish gm passes on the hyped Finn, it should be a red flag.
 
fergy57 said:
I mean he will probably be better than pool party, but that bar is pretty low.

Maybe he's turned it around, but wasn't he pushing 400lbs at training camp? Or is fortitude how many Popeyes tendies you can drive down your gullet?
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Heh. He tends to use his frustration to improve, push himself, instead of wilt and whine. Character fortitude to push through this current clusterfuck.
 
MindzEye said:
Was curious with a bit of data in whether the Habs #1 overall pick was the right one, or whether it was just a shit draft and they got the best of a bad bunch.

Name - League/PPG - Closest statistical comparables

1) Slafkovsky W - NHL .28ppg - Jess Puljujarvi, Radek Bonk, Owen Nolan, Tyler Seguin
2) Nemec D - AHL .46ppg - Moritz Seider, Liljegren, Sandin, Voynov
3) Cooley C- NCAA 1.29ppg - Phil Kessel, Larkin, Toews, Newhook
4) Wright C - NHL/AHL Incomplete due to being fucked about by his club
5) Cutter Gauthier W - NCAA 1.29ppg - Phil Kessel, Larkin, Toews, Newhook
6) Jiricek D - AHL 1.05ppg - Q Hughes, O Power, A Fox, J Johnson, R Hainsey
7) Korchinksi D - WHL 1.36ppg - O Zellweger, Bryan McCabe, J Morrissey
8) Kasper W - SHL .47ppg - Hallander, Lias Andersson, Soderstrom, Patrick Sundstrom, Zibanejad
9) Matt Savoie W - WHL 1.37ppg - Dillon Dube, B Gallagher, Fraser Minten (6 months older though)
10) Mintyukov D - OHL 1.46ppg - A DeAngelo, Wisniewski, PK Subban


After taking a quickl look, I think Jiricek was probably taken too low and should have been in the conversation for #1. 6'3 RHD with the offensive skills to do this shouldn't have been overlooked like this in a draft that lacked elite talent. No real misses so far in the top 10 though, even Kasper has some impact comparables that are reasonable best case scenarios for an 8th overall pick.

Slafkovsky is looking like a miss at the #1 though.
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I'll take Nolan. Thanks
 
Habsy said:
Holy fuck. Ok granted. Now do Joe Thornton.
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Sure

17
Joe Thornton - OHL 2.07ppg - The only...only statistical comparables to Joe Thornton as a 17 yr old in the OHL at the time was Eric Lindros, Marc Savard, & Brian Bellows.

18
Joe Thornton - NHL .13ppg - Not going to bother with comparables because obvious is obvious. He shouldn't have been in the NHL. Put up .5ppg as a 19 yr old the following season.


My point isn't that if a kid struggles as an 18 yr old in the show he's never going to be shit (funny but just today Jack Han was pointing out on twitter how many 18 yr old super prospects struggle in the NHL and then esssplode later, while talking about Jack Hughes) it's that the production before they get to the NHL is really important in determining how good they could potentially be in the NHL. Joe Thornton was an elite elite OHL product. At the time, Joe's 16 yr old OHL season was 9th best of all time, and then his 17 yr old season was top 5 all time. Your kid has nothing resembling that track record. Mediocre Liiga performance at best as a 17 yr old (your buddy Kotkaniemi was actually significantly better as a 17 yr old in liiga and our buddy Kasperi Kapanen put up similar 17 yr old numbers) and as a 16 yr was .81ppg in U20 in Finland. Recent elite Liiga based prospects have done this at the same age in U20

Pulujarvi - 1.64
Granlund - 1.62
Lundell - 1.50
Kakko - 1.45
Aho - 1.34
Rantanen - 1.06
Laine - .93 (as a 15 yr old)
Kotkaniemi - .88



His production as a kid in Finland is way more in line with 2nd tier finnish prospects taken later in the first round. Kapanen, Kupari, Teravainen and a severe over draft like Kotkaniemi than it is with the elite 16-17 yr old prospects shown above.
 
Habsy said:
If only everything was one size fits all eh?

I'm currently basing me patience on his character. He has the fortitude. It shows.

I don't think anyone thought he was elite. I know I didn't. I think he can be a very good power forward once he learns to use his frame. To his own admission he wasn't allowed to even do some of the things that are legal in the NHL. Physically.

As I've mentioned, he should have been sent to kitchener after the 9 game pony show. Then he would take a month or so to learn the American game some then you want to see him light it up. Once that happens you move him up to the A. If that repeats he's in the league at 20.

Montreal is just a bad team and I know it's fanbase, MSL and Slafkovsky are trinkets this season. Sorry Marty.
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Wait.... We agree he should be in junior?
 
MindzEye said:
Sure

17
Joe Thornton - OHL 2.07ppg - The only...only statistical comparables to Joe Thornton as a 17 yr old in the OHL at the time was Eric Lindros, Marc Savard, & Brian Bellows.

18
Joe Thornton - NHL .13ppg - Not going to bother with comparables because obvious is obvious. He shouldn't have been in the NHL. Put up .5ppg as a 19 yr old the following season.


My point isn't that if a kid struggles as an 18 yr old in the show he's never going to be shit (funny but just today Jack Han was pointing out on twitter how many 18 yr old super prospects struggle in the NHL and then esssplode later, while talking about Jack Hughes) it's that the production before they get to the NHL is really important in determining how good they could potentially be in the NHL. Joe Thornton was an elite elite OHL product. At the time, Joe's 16 yr old OHL season was 9th best of all time, and then his 17 yr old season was top 5 all time. Your kid has nothing resembling that track record. Mediocre Liiga performance at best as a 17 yr old (your buddy Kotkaniemi was actually significantly better as a 17 yr old in liiga and our buddy Kasperi Kapanen put up similar 17 yr old numbers) and as a 16 yr was .81ppg in U20 in Finland. Recent elite Liiga based prospects have done this at the same age in U20

Pulujarvi - 1.64
Granlund - 1.62
Lundell - 1.50
Kakko - 1.45
Aho - 1.34
Rantanen - 1.06
Laine - .93 (as a 15 yr old)
Kotkaniemi - .88



His production as a kid in Finland is way more in line with 2nd tier finnish prospects taken later in the first round. Kapanen, Kupari, Teravainen and a severe over draft like Kotkaniemi than it is with the elite 16-17 yr old prospects shown above.
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But the Olympics!
 
worm said:
Wait.... We agree he should be in junior?
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Should be in Liiga tbh. Easily the best of the group of NHL prospects that had 16-17 yr old seasons in Finland that line up with your boy is Teravainen and it shouldn't be lost on anyone that he was left to slow cook in Liiga for a few years after the draft and didn't come over until he was one of the best players in the league at 19-20 and then came over the north america and played a season in the AHL. He was in his D+4 season before he was ready for even middle 6 duty. A couple years of that and he broke out in his mid 20's as a consistent 60+ point guy for Carolina.
 
Habsy said:
3G 4A in 55gp

Slafkovsky > Thornton as an 18 year old prospect.

I'll take it.
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hang-in-there-champ.gif
 
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