Core 4 No More: The Motherfucking Off-Season Thread

[LeafOfFaith]

And Tavares can fuck right off if he's a stubborn bitch about it. Leafs gave him 11m per year to be the captain for absolutely 0 playoff production or success. He knows this and won't block a move despite LOFs wishes. He'll work with the Leafs to find a new home. They just have to ask him.

Leafs gave $11M+ to Matty and Marner too, with no playoff success too. Scapegoating is so fun.

Tavares isn't going to upend his whole life for one year just to do some morons a favor by relocating to some shithole and miss the chance to go for the cup with his hometown team. Sorry buddy, this is Zadina psychology 101.

 

[LeafGm]

That would basically be blowing it up and would make it difficult to contend next year. Probably wise to see what this team can do with a core 3 first and with a coach that doesn't actively suppress their offensive talent every playoff.

They can sign him and move him for an even better return in a year or so if it doesn't work out.

I get it though, he's an unlikable bitch that has had a lot of kicks at the can already. Not saying your take is irrational. I just think they'll trade one of them and I hope it's Tavares.

Yeah, it really is simply unimaginable that any team could be a contender without Mitchell Marner in their playoff lineup. Excellent point!

 

[leafman101]

Lets be honest, the Sharks should have traded Thornton and Marleau in like 2010 instead of just stripping them of the C.

Pavelski, Couture, Vlasic, Burns core 4.

 

[WellPlayed]

As much as I'm down on Marner, it's really tough to be on board with trading him right now. It just feels like you won't get value. I think I would rather see if Berube can do anything about his playoff approach. I mean, the guy has actually been PPG+ in three of eight playoff years. He is capable of it.

JT gone + pay the premium in free agency to land two of the big fish D. Make Domi your 2C (until the deadline atleast). Give Holmberg an extended look at 3c. Give Robertson and Knies minutes and let them battle with Domi and Bert for PP1 time. Give Minten and Cowan legit chances to make it, and actually try to develop them.

That + a new coach is a pretty significant overhaul that I can get behind. Add at the deadline accordingly.

 

[manny]

The only way to get good value for Marner is if he’s willing to work out a reasonable extension with the team he’s traded to. Like Tkachuk. Something tells me Mitch will not do that. So they might as well keep him and hope that any contract-year bump extends into the playoffs.

 

[Boogmour]

I've hated Marner's mental makeup since he came into the league. From treating the puck like a grenade under pressure to his stupid answers post game interviews. For a guy who supposedly idolized Doug Gilmour, he's lucky if he's got about 1/4 of the drive and heart. Kid is floater by nature, needs the open ice or he can't and won't do anything to help.

It certainly would be interesting to see what Berube can do with him though. My gut says Marner would crumble under Berube. Lamoriello, knew Marner's issues from the start. One of the reasons why he brought Matt Martin in to play on his line. Didn't exactly help change his game but if you put Marner on line with two guys that can help open up the ice, it will excel his game.

Hate the thought of trading him for cents on the dollar but he's the biggest trade chip and one that can free up cap space. Like it or not, we're stuck with Tavares, i don't see any team valuing his aging gameplay or his massive cap hit (unless we sweeten the deal with a 1rst round pick). If Treliving can send him packing, without having to sweeten the deal, while saving cap space, that would be a huge feat.

 

[LeafGm]

The only way to get good value for Marner is if he’s willing to work out a reasonable extension with the team he’s traded to. Like Tkachuk. Something tells me Mitch will not do that. So they might as well keep him and hope that any contract-year bump extends into the playoffs.

I fully expect him and his camp to flex his NMC to maximum effect and fuck the Leafs as hard as possible. Whether that’s refusing to waive at all, or by minimizing the return they can get for him by only accepting a trade to one specific team, and refusing to negotiate an extension as part of a trade.

And honestly, while that obviously wouldn’t make me feel any better about him, players can use NMC’s however they want. At the end of the day, it’s the Leafs’ fuckup for giving him one in the first place, and then not taking the opportunity to trade him last summer before it kicked in.

And all that said, I’d still trade him this summer if at all possible. Whatever we get for him would be more than what we’d get when he walks for nothing as a UFA. And we absolutely cannot waste another year trying to win with this mopey, choking, butter-soft, crybaby little piece of shit.

 

[leafman101]

Playoffs 5v5 P/60, last 5 years:
Foligno - 1.26 p/60
Tavares: -1.22
Boosh - 1.2
ZAR - 1.13

 

[LeafOfFaith]

I fully expect him and his camp to flex his NMC to maximum effect and fuck the Leafs as hard as possible. Whether that’s refusing to waive at all, or by minimizing the return they can get for him by only accepting a trade to one specific team, and refusing to negotiate an extension as part of a trade.

Whatever he does, hope it all leads to the Leafs signing an extension with him before the season starts.

Even if you want to trade him, that should be your hope. It puts you in no different position than right now with his NMC, but then you hold the rights to the rest of his career, and if he's going to be forced to waive at some point, let it be with that in place.

 

[LeafGm]

Whatever he does, hope it all leads to the Leafs signing an extension with him before the season starts.

Even if you want to trade him, that should be your hope. It puts you in no different position than right now with his NMC, but then you hold the rights to the rest of his career, and if he's going to be forced to waive at some point, let it be with that in place.

I completely reject out-of-hand the notion that handing Marner an additional eight years with a full NMC and $13M AAV will somehow increase his trade value, or give the Leafs more control over the situation.

Just dump him now and be done with it.

 

[LeafOfFaith]

I completely reject out-of-hand the notion that handing Marner an additional eight years with a full NMC and $13M AAV will somehow increase his trade value, or give the Leafs more control over the situation.

Just dump him now and be done with it.

They should definitely not give him some joke amount that makes him untradeable, that's for sure.

But they should use their best fucking efforts right now to exploit the current mood around the team and him and sign him to a 5-8 year deal at $11M or $11.5M and start the year with him under the new coach.

If next year is the same as this year, then do whatever.

Also, you don't "dump" a Mitch Marner. That's fucking lunacy.

 

[manny]

I guess if you think Marner will sign now for less than Nylander got, and without a NMC, that makes a lot of sense.

 

[LeafOfFaith]

He'd never sign without an NMC. Highly doubtful he'd take less than Nylander.

But this is the opportunity now to try to sign him to the exact same deal as Willy.

 

[LeafGm]

They should definitely not give him some joke amount that makes him untradeable, that's for sure.

But they should use their best fucking efforts right now to exploit the current mood around the team and him and sign him to a 5-8 year deal at $11M or $11.5M and start the year with him under the new coach.

If next year is the same as this year, then do whatever.

Also, you don't "dump" a Mitch Marner. That's fucking lunacy.

It’s complete fantasyland stuff to expect that Mitch will re-sign for a pay-cut on his next year (relative to percentage of cap). Or for the same or less AAV than Nylander just got.

$13M may be on the high-end, but I can guarantee you his starting ask will be around there, and Paul’s special boy won’t settle for anything less than an AAV well north of $12M.

 

[leafman101]

It really sucks that over the course of 4 years, 3 Toronto born superstars became UFAs and we got the only one that didn't end up winning a cup after signing the deal.

The alternate universe where the core 4 worked is the one were we got Stamkos or Pietro instead of Tavares.

 

[GEEMAN]

I guess if you think Marner will sign now for less than Nylander got, and without a NMC, that makes a lot of sense.

Mitch the bitch isnt doing the Leafs any favours , he holds the poker chips

 

[Blueman]

Tavares isn't going to upend his whole life for one year just to do some morons a favor by relocating to some shithole and miss the chance to go for the cup with his hometown team. Sorry buddy, this is Zadina psychology 101.

he's going to upend his life this year or next either way if they've decided to move on from him.

 

[Hoss]

Marner will never take less.

His trade is for, younger, hungrier, bigger forward depth or a playoff vet that still has some play and around 6 million in cap relief after the trade.

Tavares, is a salary dump and we will be lucky and grateful for a player or two and picks.

Use the 5 mill remaining from the Marner deal with the 8-9 million saved on the Tavares deal and you spend that money on the D and the assets to maybe get a goalie via trade.

Tanev and Montour please, and Edmunston as the number 6-7 guy.

 

[LeafGm]

he's going to upend his life this year or next either way if they've decided to move on from him.

In the LOF cinematic universe, Tavares plays out the final year of his contract as a Leaf next season, then he and the Leafs spend the rest of his career happily signing NHL minimum deals for him to stay in Toronto.

 

[Slinger 48]

I fully expect him and his camp to flex his NMC to maximum effect and fuck the Leafs as hard as possible. Whether that’s refusing to waive at all, or by minimizing the return they can get for him by only accepting a trade to one specific team, and refusing to negotiate an extension as part of a trade.

And honestly, while that obviously wouldn’t make me feel any better about him, players can use NMC’s however they want. At the end of the day, it’s the Leafs’ fuckup for giving him one in the first place, and then not taking the opportunity to trade him last summer before it kicked in.

And all that said, I’d still trade him this summer if at all possible. Whatever we get for him would be more than what we’d get when he walks for nothing as a UFA. And we absolutely cannot waste another year trying to win with this mopey, choking, butter-soft, crybaby little piece of shit.

I laughed when I read your last paragraph.

I do think there is a lot of truth in it though. I've admired many things Marner has done but I've never liked him because of the traits that your apt description highlights.

Trade him and let the chips fall where they may. Trade Tavares too.