Core 4 No More: The Motherfucking Off-Season Thread

[MyNameIsJonas]

I think you try to trade him pretty aggressively and it's tough for me to say that. Even with my emotions dying down I feel like you need to move on from him and reallocate some of that money to a stud d or two. I get that they've wasted money on trash depth but every team needs some grace and room for a couple mistake contracts. No team is perfect. And if anything they've shied away from acquiring more elite talent because of their cap structure. Probably too much, but they've passed up some elite d in order to keep the band together and I think that was a mistake.

But I only say that because I'm pretty positive they'll be able to get excellent value for him and/or they should be able to identify a player that isn't valued as highly as he should be. The NMC is a non factor for me.

Of course this depends on a smart gm and not Tre making the trade. Which is a pipe dream.

I think i agree with this.

Enough teams will be interested to where a bidding war will take place, and outside of say, Buffalo or Columbus i think Marner would welcome a deal to a place where there isnt a microphone in his face everyday, at his core, i think he's a coward.

 

[MindzEye]

So if you aren't trading Marner, which path do you choose?

Re-sign him for $12.5M+ per season, or keep him for next season & let him walk as a UFA?

Gotta re sign him at that point and just change the DNA of the group to be faster, possession centric, etc. Fwiw, I don't think after this playoff flop he's going to be pointing at Auston money. I'd look to call his bluff and walk him to free agency with a Willy-ish offer open to him.

There's levels to this shit and Auston is on another level and frankly, we saw this year that Willy is on his level.

So yeah, my order of operations is:

1) trade him in a legit hockey trade for something resembling good value for a 90-100 point RW
2) Offer him for a Willy-ish extension
3) trade him for a decent, but not ideal package if it suits the right needs (Think Danault + Anderson from LAK, Sorokin + from NYI, etc)
4) Call his contract bluff and enter the season with him on his last year, with the Willyish deal an open offer and walk him to UFA.
5) Go to UFA with him at the same money (8 x ~11.75) and if someone wants to go 7 x 14 or something loony, enjoy Utah or NYI, or wherever the fuck.

 

[MindzEye]

We do have plenty of capspace to sign two very good dmen.

I don't know skjei and pesce are that, but maybe.

Roy is probably > Pesce.

 

[MyNameIsJonas]

I don’t think it’s nearly as hard to trade a guy like Marner and get value as people are pretending. He’s awesome and it’s hard to get players like that in their prime.

Just gotta find the right team that has a lot of D but needs a forward like the Byram/Middlestat trade.

And if that trade isn’t there then you keep him. I don’t really see any other choice.

but keep and extend or keep and let him walk.

there is more to this than simply trade or not trade

 

[MyNameIsJonas]

Gotta re sign him at that point and just change the DNA of the group to be faster, possession centric, etc. Fwiw, I don't think after this playoff flop he's going to be pointing at Auston money. I'd look to call his bluff and walk him to free agency with a Willy-ish offer open to him.

There's levels to this shit and Auston is on another level and frankly, we saw this year that Willy is on his level.

So yeah, my order of operations is:

1) trade him in a legit hockey trade for something resembling good value for a 90-100 point RW
2) Offer him for a Willy-ish extension
3) trade him for a decent, but not ideal package if it suits the right needs (Think Danault + Anderson from LAK, Sorokin + from NYI, etc)
4) Call his contract bluff and enter the season with him on his last year, with the Willyish deal an open offer and walk him to UFA.
5) Go to UFA with him at the same money (8 x ~11.75) and if someone wants to go 7 x 14 or something loony, enjoy Utah or NYI, or wherever the fuck.

I think i would want Byfield if i had to take Danault in an LAK deal

 

[leafman101]

but keep and extend or keep and let him walk.

there is more to this than simply trade or not trade

No there isn’t because you don’t let a player like that walk for nothing.

 

[zeke]

Roy is probably > Pesce.

Problem with all three names is that they have all played behind or with elite dmen who get elite workloads and qoc, so it's hard to tell.

 

[MyNameIsJonas]

No there isn’t because you don’t let a player like that walk for nothing.

I think locking him up at 13ish is just as bad.

 

[MyNameIsJonas]

I dunno if Jersey wants a Marner, but they have alot of interesting things they could trade.

 

[Preston]

Quite frankly the only sticking point to trading Marner for me is who the current gm is. It can't be Tre. It just can't.

 

[leafman101]

It doesn’t matter because they are all good, but none of them are that elite #1 we really want.

So it’s really who is willing to sign the most reasonable contract. Would the D be any better with Skjei and Roy vs Walker and Tanev vs Montour and Peece? Probably not.

 

[MindzEye]

I don’t think it’s nearly as hard to trade a guy like Marner and get value as people are pretending. He’s awesome and it’s hard to get players like that in their prime.

Just gotta find the right team that has a lot of D but needs a forward like the Byram/Middlestat trade. Is Carolina going to resign Slavin. Would Buffalo trade Power? Would Anaheim move Minunyuk or Zellweger? Teams will want Marner.

And if that trade isn’t there then you keep him. I don’t really see any other choice.

It's funny, when I've been looking at situations I want to be involved in on a Marner trade I keep looking at Detroit.

Seider & Raymond for Marner?

Sieder got kind of mauled in the hardest matchup minutes in the NHL this year, but he didn't get mauled as much as he should have on a badish team with little to no help. Sign Skjei and trade Marner for Seider and whatever the best next piece you can get, and that's probably a top pairing that fucks.

Skjei-Seider
Rielly-Lilly/McCabe
Benoit-Lilly/McCabe

That blueline probably...probably fucks.

 

[MyNameIsJonas]

Quite frankly the only sticking point to trading Marner for me is who the current gm is. It can't be Tre. It just can't.

His top priority for a return will be " is player X big" followed by " is player X nasty"

I think the ball here was dropped when you maybe get Tkachuk for Marner

 

[leafman101]

Another interesting target could be Hronek. Van doesn’t have a ton of cap flexibility to pay him big money.

 

[MyNameIsJonas]

It's funny, when I've been looking at situations I want to be involved in on a Marner trade I keep looking at Detroit.

Seider & Raymond for Marner?

Sieder got kind of mauled in the hardest matchup minutes in the NHL this year, but he didn't get mauled as much as he should have on a badish team with little to no help. Sign Skjei and trade Marner for Seider and whatever the best next piece you can get, and that's probably a top pairing that fucks.

Skjei-Seider
Rielly-Lilly/McCabe
Benoit-Lilly/McCabe

That blueline probably...probably fucks.

I can see Detroit looking at this hard

depending on who runs the Leafs though i think having Lilly in there is silly

 

[LeafOfFaith]

View: https://x.com/sid_seixeiro/status/1787195153414852861?s=46

Pathetic fucking clown. He’s gone.

And that Tkachuk comment was icing on the cake. We knew they’d lose somehow. Sorry, bye Shanny and everyone with an office.

 

[MyNameIsJonas]

Pathetic fucking clown. He’s gone.

And that Tkachuk comment was icing on the cake. We knew they’d lose somehow. Sorry, bye Shanny and everyone with an office.

I think if you can get away with Keeping Tre in some sort of Jay Feaster role, where he literally makes no actual decisions but comes out and speaks to the media and does pointless press conferences

 

[MindzEye]

Another interesting target could be Hronek. Van doesn’t have a ton of cap flexibility to pay him big money.

As a right handed Rielly replacement, yeah. But he has defensively issues similar to Rielly's.

 

[LeafOfFaith]

I think you try to trade him pretty aggressively and it's tough for me to say that. Even with my emotions dying down I feel like you need to move on from him and reallocate some of that money to a stud d or two. I get that they've wasted money on trash depth but every team needs some grace and room for a couple mistake contracts. No team is perfect. And if anything they've shied away from acquiring more elite talent because of their cap structure. Probably too much, but they've passed up some elite d in order to keep the band together and I think that was a mistake.

But I only say that because I'm pretty positive they'll be able to get excellent value for him and/or they should be able to identify a player that isn't valued as highly as he should be. The NMC is a non factor for me.

Of course this depends on a smart gm and not Tre making the trade. Which is a pipe dream.

Having Knies, Robertson, Minten, and Cowan all emerge would make losing Marner much less painful.

But we don’t know how many of those guys will be able to put up points. Deleting 100 points from the roster isn’t something we won’t feel, and who knows how much worse it’ll be in the playoffs.

 

[MindzEye]

I can see Detroit looking at this hard

depending on who runs the Leafs though i think having Lilly in there is silly

Lilly is a just turned 25 yr old 2 way RHD just entering the years where most high end defenders become high end defenders. GIving up on him because he was shit down the stretch and in the playoffs would be dumb as fuck. If those are the type of moves we're making, we're fucked anyway.