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New Canadian Politics Thread

All while employment remains at historically high national levels.

The noise has taken over the election. Not reality.

Employment levels are at record highs in the states, doesn't make Trump a good leader.

Now I'm not saying trudeau is trump, but the economy is but one part of the equation.
 
Canada has an incredible ability to care about everything else over Indigenous Peoples. It's truly a historic and current shame that everyone should feel.

I am very glad the Liberals took some leadership and funded this inquiry. The truth needs to come out.

The question is: Do enough people care? I sure hope so.

People stopped caring the second the inquiry tossed the genocide word out willy nilly.

I think Canadians would have rallied behind common sense policies to reduce the number of missing and murdered indegeneous women, but accusing Canada of genocide was jumping the shark and now nobody will take it seriously.
 
People stopped caring the second the inquiry tossed the genocide word out willy nilly.

I think Canadians would have rallied behind common sense policies to reduce the number of missing and murdered indegeneous women, but accusing Canada of genocide was jumping the shark and now nobody will take it seriously.

Yep, this.

Sign me up for actual fixes to native issues. Living out west for near a decade opened my eyes to a lot of their problems in a way living in Ontario shields you from, but miss me with this genocide shite. I have zero problems with recognizing the wrongs committed by the Canadian government against first nations, but when we use the same word to describe it as is used to the describe the ****ing holocaust, someone has lost the plot somewhere.
 
To clarify, since I'm not sure what the answer to this is:

Does this report claim that Canada has historically been responsible for genocide against its Native population?

Or is it claiming that Canada is currently engaged in genocide against its Native population up to the present day?
 
To clarify, since I'm not sure what the answer to this is:

Does this report claim that Canada has historically been responsible for genocide against its Native population?

Or is it claiming that Canada is currently engaged in genocide against its Native population up to the present day?

The report states that it is currently going on.

Here's why I struggle with calling this genocide

- What we're really talking about is a much higher than average murder rate for this specific demographic (native women). They make up 4% of the Canadian population, but account for 16% of murders between 1980 and 2012. Obviously a shocking statistic. The total amount of victims (murdered and "missing") is believed to be in the range of 4000 total victims. 80% of these cases are considered "resolved" by the RCMP.

- The government didn't kill these women, full stop. The most common perpetrator is native men, also full ****ing stop. 70% according to a RCMP study.

So where exactly is the argument that the Canadian government is committing genocide? Native women aren't being systematically targeted by the Canadian government, they're being killed by native men. They're not being wiped out wholesale, they're just being killed at a higher rate than other canadian women (7x more likely).

I'm not arguing that the relationship between first nations is good, either now or historically. I'm not arguing that the Canadian government has done enough to address the issues of first nations. But this isn't a genocide, full stop.
 
Would "cultural" genocide be more appropriate?

I think it devalues the impact of what should be the filthiest word in the human language personally.

With that said though, the report isn't claiming that the genocide is in the past, or specifically linked to residential schools. It's claiming that all Canadians are currently taking part in genocide because of the abnormally high rates at which native men murder native women.
 
but i mean it was genocide.

not in accordance with my understanding of the word, no.

but I do want to hear the arguments supporting your position before I fully make up my mind.

my first instinct is to react the way Mindz and Altair did to the use of the term 'genocide' in this context. but maybe you can sway me.

for me, a genocide would be something like what happened in Rwanda, the Holocaust, the recent attacks against the Rohingya in Myanmar probably also qualifies. but those are large scale, organized campaigns aimed at wiping out a particular ethnic group. if the report were to allege that Canada was guilty of historic genocide against FNMI people, then I think that is harder to argue. but I don't understand how there could be a current, ongoing genocide, perpetrated by the government.
 
eh, what we did to the natives was obviously genocide.

now what this report is talking about specifically, i don't know.
 
eh, what we did to the natives was obviously genocide.

How so?

We're not talking about systemic racism and abuse. We're talking about an actual attempt to eliminate them. Residential schools were a whole bag of abusive, racist stupidity, but they weren't an actual attempt to end the native people.

now what this report is talking about specifically, i don't know.

Clearly
 
Would "cultural" genocide be more appropriate?

I'm ready to offend I guess...cause I hate this. I was born in Canada to people whose parents were very much from the old country, bringing their culture with them.
Over the years I have watched as cultures sort of washed together as we create our own traditions...I just don't believe that living in the past is any help at all.

Having said that, systematically going after a culture to delete it is wrong...but I am all for looking to the future.
Enough embracing the past, it wasn't really all that great anyways.
 
not in accordance with my understanding of the word, no.

but I do want to hear the arguments supporting your position before I fully make up my mind.

my first instinct is to react the way Mindz and Altair did to the use of the term 'genocide' in this context. but maybe you can sway me.

for me, a genocide would be something like what happened in Rwanda, the Holocaust, the recent attacks against the Rohingya in Myanmar probably also qualifies. but those are large scale, organized campaigns aimed at wiping out a particular ethnic group. if the report were to allege that Canada was guilty of historic genocide against FNMI people, then I think that is harder to argue. but I don't understand how there could be a current, ongoing genocide, perpetrated by the government.

The effort to push indegeneous people off their traditional lands on to useless reserves could be the closest thing to genocide. Nothing compared to the trail of tears, but close enough.

Residential schools and the effort to destroy indegeneous culture would be the next closest and still far below the bar of genocide.

But to say what's happening today a genocide, that's just jumping the shark. Its such complete and utter bunk that it underminds the seriousness of the entire report.

Find me another people who are the target of genocide by the state who receive the billions of dollars that they do, a minister in charge of their affairs, the power to stop infrastructure projects and inquiries trying to resolve their legitimate grievances.

I think Canadians as a whole would love to improve things for indegeneous Canadians in common sense ways that doesnt involve throwing yet more money at them that isn't accountable to anyone but band chiefs.

To say that Canada is currently engaging in genocide because indegeneous men are killing indegeneous women at a much higher rate than non indegeneous men are killing non indegeneous women is so insulting that this report dies before any meaningful change occurs.

Canadians are going to look at each other, ask if they are currently engaging in genocide, obviously come to the conclusion of, hell no, we are not, and move right on.
 
To add, if the commissioners of the report feel so strongly that this genocide continues to present day, drag Canada in front of the international criminal court.

I would love to see that.
 
http://nationalpost.com/opinion/kel...chance-to-right-some-wrongs-for-first-nations

Marion Buller has done no one any favours with her inquiry’s sweeping denunciation of Canada as a society of mass killers.

She’s done nothing to enhance support among Canadians, who will mostly dismiss her report’s most contentious finding out of hand. She has offered no aid to a federal government that would desperately like to do something right on Aboriginal claims but has just been told it’s running an extermination project. And she certainly hasn’t helped Canada’s First Nations, which are likely to see their place on the national priority list fall deeper into the status of hopeless causes as people conclude there’s simply no means by which their demands and aspirations can be satisfied.

That’s a sad thing. Because despite the conclusion of the inquiry that Canada’s goal in its treatment of its native people is one of annihilation, there exists a great well of sympathy for the conditions they have been reduced to, an acceptance that past practices have been wrong-headed and damaging, and a willingness to go to considerable lengths to make it right. But people can only do the possible, and demanding the impossible is no road to success.

Very sad indeed.
 
Minister of indegeneous affairs on CTV struggling to respond to the question of whether Canada, as a signature of the prevention of genocide, will need to round up those responsible for the ongoing genocide of indegeneous people and bring them to justice.

Or whether the UN will need to show up and investigate claims of genocide. Or whether we will allow the Organization of American states, OAS to investigate this Canadian genocide.

This is going to poll well.
 
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