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OT: The Toronto Blue Jays

I think if this move was made to get Bryan Reynolds less people would be upset.

Im not entirely sure Bryan Reynolds is better than Daulton Varsho, it's damn close.

I also suspect with Lourdes out that there is an opening for another RH bat, i do wonder if Nelson Cruz is now a fit considering our defensive OF, or possibly Adam Duval
 
axlsalinger said:
After some struggling to adjust to MLB pitching basically broke out last year, so there is still upside here with the bat. Dude hit .301 and .313 in his AA and AAA stints.
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I don't know about calling it a breakout. Went from 99 wRC+ in his 2nd season to 106 in his 3rd. Almost 1000 PA into his career and 26 yrs old, the bat to ball skills just might not be there for him to maintain a power approach and make consistent contact.
axlsalinger said:
Also scouts were saying last year that unless Moreno overhauls his swing, he won't hit for much power in the bigs.
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His hit tool and defensive package are so, so good though. If he's just a guy with gap power (which he had in AA/AAA at 20-21), he could still be a 4+ WAR catcher for the next decade.
 
MyNameIsJonas said:
I think if this move was made to get Bryan Reynolds less people would be upset.

Im not entirely sure Bryan Reynolds is better than Daulton Varsho, it's damn close.
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That comes down to whether Varsho's defensive value was legit or not last season...also if Reynolds defensive struggles were legit or not. If Reynolds is actually an average OF defender (he was real bad last season, but played all year in CF) and a 125-140 wRC+ stick...then yeah, way more impactful player imo.
 
MindzEye said:
That comes down to whether Varsho's defensive value was legit or not last season...also if Reynolds defensive struggles were legit or not. If Reynolds is actually an average OF defender (he was real bad last season, but played all year in CF) and a 125-140 wRC+ stick...then yeah, way more impactful player imo.
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It could be close, but we didn't line up with Pitt in a trade, they have C in the system

I'd rather trade Gabe for Varsho than Teidemann for Reynolds.
 
Our bench requires a RHH that could or could not play the OF ( kinda describes Lourdes)

Adam Duval
AJ Pollock
Nelson Cruz
Andrew McCutchen

all offer varying degrees of abilities that i think can help. If you go Cruz, which i'd be very tempted to do ( he's the closest thing to replacing Teo, if he hasn't fallen off a cliff) then Cavan is your OF4, which, is, fine. The others, especially Duval and Pollock can take a shift in the OF.

I also would not be surprised by a Espinal for Liam Hendriks trade, and the team signing a guy like Profar.
 
MindzEye said:
I don't know about calling it a breakout. Went from 99 wRC+ in his 2nd season to 106 in his 3rd. Almost 1000 PA into his career and 26 yrs old, the bat to ball skills just might not be there for him to maintain a power approach and make consistent contact.
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I feel reasonably confident in the hit tool looking at the minor league numbers, obviously BA is a limited stat but .311-.286-.301-.313 dating back to 2017 seems pretty consistent, shift restrictions will help and his MLB Babips (.286 and .269) also seem a bit low for a fast guy who sat in the .317-.341 range in the minors.

And I called it a "breakout" just based on what people around the game were saying about him last year.

His hit tool and defensive package are so, so good though. If he's just a guy with gap power (which he had in AA/AAA at 20-21), he could still be a 4+ WAR catcher for the next decade.
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He's going to be a good catcher for sure, and obviously you have to give up good pieces to get good players, but if the power is middling it will definitely limit his upside.
 
Varsho is good but that's not the return you need from trading one of the better assets in baseball.

This unfortunately all about thinking that Varsho will consistently be paid a value salary thanks to his middling top line stats.
 
zeke said:
Varsho is good but that's not the return you need from trading one of the better assets in baseball.

This unfortunately all about thinking that Varsho will consistently be paid a value salary thanks to his middling top line stats.
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No knock on Varsho but he does have his cons. 101 lifetime WRC for one of the best prospects in baseball is not the best trade IMO. I get it's about the D, but KK is in C next year and Varsho projects for 3.1 fWAR. I could easily see Moreno coming very close to the same production as Varsho next year.
 
axlsalinger said:
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Lazy analysis. "But the shift" is the lazy throw away analysis of this winter imo.

in Varsho's case, yes he's a pull hitter, but it's mostly flyballs.

If you're looking for optimism. It's that he's a flyball hitter going from a bottom 5 HR park that has a 413 RF power alley to a top 10 HR park that is symmetrical. I don't think we'll see a significant contact surge, but he could definitely hit 30+ and see a bit of a bump in ISO & wRC+ from that.
 
zeke said:
Varsho is good but that's not the return you need from trading one of the better assets in baseball.

This unfortunately all about thinking that Varsho will consistently be paid a value salary thanks to his middling top line stats.
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Yeah, that's my take here. This is a Shatkins "well if we're paying him 15 dollars and hour and getting 3 WAR for 4 years, that's ideal" type move.
 
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