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Religion

OT: American Politics

It's also great to play devil's advocate with, since most people don't even know a lot about their own religion.

Tell someone that Jesus was actually likely born in the spring and Christmas Day was borrowed from the Pagans and watch them squirm
 
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Re: OT: American Politics

Tell someone that Jesus was actually likely born in the spring and Christmas Day was borrowed from the Pagans and watch squirm

I think his birth is more like early fall? Based on when Shepherds would be out in the fields tending their flocks. Although I don't think there's a consensus time, other than "no way in hell was it the Winter".
 
Re: OT: American Politics

Tell someone that Jesus was actually likely born in the spring and Christmas Day was borrowed from the Pagans and watch them squirm

Pretty well all of the christian holidays were pagan holidays first...easier to get people to your side that way.
 
Re: OT: American Politics

I think his birth is more like early fall? Based on when Shepherds would be out in the fields tending their flocks. Although I don't think there's a consensus time, other than "no way in hell was it the Winter".

I tend to think most Christians can agree that the exact date of his birth is unknown. All that is mentioned in most accounts is that it was around the time of King Herod. As you mentioned, if you go by when shapers would be in the fields it would place the birth sometime in the summer or fall.
 
Re: OT: American Politics

well, there's that thing where the entire story of his birth and childhood (listed only in matthew and luke) was made up after the fact to fit the ancient jewish legends. trying to turn him into a new moses.
 
Re: OT: American Politics

Some believe it was likely the spring due to the New Testament noting the Romans taking census during the birth and the animals not being in the manger when Mary visits

It's all open for interpretation though
 
Re: OT: American Politics

the whole birth legend is a clear copy of moses' birth.
 
Re: OT: American Politics

herod/pharoah killing all the babies, escape into Egypt, return to judea, 1st speech from a mountain, etc
 
Re: OT: American Politics

it was a reboot. with less anger and vengeance.
 
Re: OT: American Politics

herod/pharoah killing all the babies, escape into Egypt, return to judea, 1st speech from a mountain, etc

There are certain myths, stories that are retreads, but really, unless someone uses religious faith to hurt others, why should anyone care what another believes.
 
Re: OT: American Politics

lots of reboots in the bible

noah's ark for example

There's enough of those stories to make me think there was some kind of global event...though obviously not the entire planet flooding.

Gilgamesh was the first story, I think.
 
Re: OT: American Politics

Anyone read Sapiens by Yuval Harari? Its a very interesting read about the history of our species and how we got here.

It changed my perspective on religion. Religion has absolutely caused a ton of damage throughout history, but his argument is it is also one of the most important developments in the rise of our species. Essentially the argument is humans are genetically programmed to live in small communities of 150 or less, which we did for most of human history. What allowed us to exceed our genetic limitations and cooperate on a global level is our ability to communicate about things that do not actually exist e.g. god, money, corporations, rights. No other species has shown the ability to do this. Other primates can communicate about things which exist, or even lie about things which exist, for example monkeys have been observed yelling "LION" when there is no lion to scare other monkeys away from food. However, humans are the only ones that have evidence of mythology which goes back 100,000 years to cave drawings of humans with lion heads etc. This includes other human species.

The ability to communicate about myths allowed the creation common ground and trust between different small human tribes to cooperate in larger and larger groups. It created goals beyond the survival of your tribe. This trust extended beyond language barriers, geographic barriers. This allowed sapiens to come together and trade, worship, build structures like Stone Henge or Gobeckli Tepe, and that opened pandora's box. Trade leads to a currency, which leads to specialization, to the point where we have a market driven world entirely based on trust between a small number of large tribes.

His definition of religion is broad and includes things like capitalism, liberalism etc. which are far more powerful today than theistic religions. People have historically, and continue, to exploit religion for personal gain, however, religion is also fundamentally important to humans evolving much faster than our genetics allow.

Anyway great book.
 
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