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The Mother-fucking goddamn Off-season Thread

Wayward DP said:
fine isn't good enough though. hasn't been for the past seven years.

that's the issue.

I think folks are right to be skeptical until we see any improved results.
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Oh I'm skeptical as hell too. But it was always gonna be that way no matter who they hired and especially if they kept Kyle. I'm just glad they went with a guy that values some of the forward thinking metrics in the sport because it could have gone the complete opposite way. It was the bare minimum I ever wanted.

But yes, this wasn't my first choice and everyone has all the reason to be skeptical. But the "it's over, just give up, he will 100% be shit" brigade needs to relax a bit here. He did enough things well in Calgary to be hopeful.
 
Preston said:
Yes you have listed a lot of his bad moves. Others have listed a lot of Kyle's bad moves. I haven't denied that those moves were made. I will caution you to assume that the Leafs are completely fucked though. This is a pretty good team and the new GM has done plenty of good, enough to not be suicidal over. Deep breaths.
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for clarity, I'm just sour about Treliving. to me, this signals a return to a lot of the OBC shit I had hoped the organization (and league) were beyond. on top of his questionable history of cap management. plus the media feeding frenzy BS.

I don't fully blame him for losing Gaudreau and Tkachuk though. Tough to accurately assess blame without knowing all the details.

this just seems like we're gonna keep spinning our wheels similarly to how we have been, which has not produced results.
 
zeke said:
and again, the leafs have been paying pretty much just as much for their goalies.
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…and again leaves out my entire point that he got better goaltending in two out of three years, while also avoiding adding three more years of 34yo Markstrom at $6m per year, in the process.

Thats hugely significant….if we had to pay $6m for three more years of Markstrom playing at a .904 or .892 level it’s a fucking disaster.

…avoiding those kinds of errors, is a valuable skill in a GM.
 
Over the 3 years since they signed Markstrom:

CGY #16 (~$7.5m aav)
TOR #14 (~$6.5m aav)

meh.
 
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Given how Markstrom played in the last couple seasons in Van prior to signing him, and how Jack played his last two years here….I think it’s more likely than not, Treliving signs Jack to that Oilers contract and keeps him.


…or it mirrors the Markstrom move enough, it’s easy to picture.
 
Montana said:
…and again leaves out my entire point that he got better goaltending in two out of three years, while also avoiding adding three more years of 34yo Markstrom at $6m per year, in the process.

Thats hugely significant….if we had to pay $6m for three more years of Markstrom playing at a .904 or .892 level it’s a fucking disaster.

…avoiding those kinds of errors, is a valuable skill in a GM.
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3yrs of Markstrom at $6m, 1yrs of Murray at $4.8.

meh.
 
zeke said:
Over the 3 years since they signed Markstrom:

CGY #16 (~$7.4m aav)
TOR #14 (~$7.0m aav)

meh.
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Montana said:
…and again leaves out my entire point that he got better goaltending in two out of three years, while also avoiding adding three more years of 34yo Markstrom at $6m per year, in the process.

Thats hugely significant….if we had to pay $6m for three more years of Markstrom playing at a .904 or .892 level it’s a fucking disaster.

…avoiding those kinds of errors, is a valuable skill in a GM.
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3yrs of Markstrom at $6m (a full time starting goalie just as likely to bounce back again), vs 1yrs of Murray at $4.8m (can't even stay healthy).....

...MEH.

and Dubas would just find another crappy goalie to waste money on like he does every year anyways.
 
Again, dunking on yourself….all easy to get out of, never crippling because you used your savings to hedge your bet. (because not paying one guy $6m allows you to).

Mrazek didn’t hurt us, cause we had Jack.
Murray doesn’t hurt us because we have Samsonov. (and you know if he’s not playing he’s on LTIR).

….meanwhile when your $6m Markstrom is failing at a .904 clip, or .892….you just eat for those 100 games.

….and then three more years after that.
 
zeke said:
Hyman
Mikheyev
Bunting
Moore
Barabanov
Marchment
Knies
Robertson

And Jarnkrok did it this year for cheap too. And Engvall did it immediqtely for NYI.

We had the talent at the right price. The plan could have worked.
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Well two kids + 3 guys who never got a shot. But I’d take the flames two over all of those guys by a mile aside from hyman
 
you've lost the plot.

who the fuck cares that they're "never crippled longterm" when every fucking year they spend the same money for the same middling results anyways.

and you're forgetting that they actually had to pay capital to get rid of mrazek and now murray too.
 
god knows we would have loved to see Dubas actually go cheap with goalies and use the money elsewhere but he never actually did. and despite spending that money we never even knew who the fuck our starter was heading into any playoffs.
 
Preston said:
We are now in the "dubas actually dealt with goaltending great" part of the argument. Sweet.
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nah…dealt with it adequately, with low risk gambles that got the job done serviceably. (and in a better manner than Treliving with Markstrom)

if he had an opportunity at elite for cheap/something we could afford and whiffed?..that’s a huge L.
 
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